There's only one reason Leonard Peltier is still behind bars—because he is guilty beyond any doubt and thoroughly unrepentant. That's why no president including President Obama has seen fit to endorse Peltier’s manufactured persona as a "human rights activist." The evidence against Peltier is overwhelming. His boast of how he murdered FBI Agent Ronald Williams matched the autopsy report, “The motherf---er was begging for his life but I shot him anyway,” as recalled under oath in 2004 by KaMook Nichols, the former common-law wife of AIM founder Dennis Banks. At the 1974 AIM gathering in Farmington, NM, Peltier interrogated future AIM murder victim Anna Mae Pictou Aquash by putting a loaded gun in her mouth calling it “truth serum.” Her murder is the subject of a DocuSeries now streaming on Hulu. And as documented in the historical exposé, American Indian Mafia, Peltier's vanity project has only served to fool millions of trusting fans and denigrate the legacy of genuine political prisoners and authentic Indian warriors.
"Victims' Rights" advocates typically overlook those victims like the ones you mention, Marcie, who plead for the merciful side of justice in excluding the death penalty from being applied to those who brought them so much pain.
The media drumbeat that "closure" and "justice" can only be obtained by an Old-West-Style hangin' in the public square has overwhelmed the better angels of our nature.
Trump is perfectly within his authority to commute Rooff, Tsarnaeve and Bowers if he wants to. I think it's brilliant of Biden to leave these guys for Trump to have to deal with.
The concept of pulling the death sentence rug out from under Trump is delicious....I'd not thought of it that way. Now Trump can go the extra mile, and say he really sympathizes with the other three who are guilty of such horrible crimes so he'll out-mercy Biden and pardon them...because he really believes in the rule of law....and Mark Milley....
This might not make any sense, and its something that I haven't seen mentioned before, so maybe what I'm going to say is really flawed. I'm against the death penalty across the board primarily for reasons of the chance of an innocent person being executed, its racist distribution and bias. I wouldn't be a death qualified jury (for one reason my state doesn't have capital punishment) but otherwise I don't think I could make that decision to sentence another person to death. On the other hand, when someone like McVeigh is sentenced to death I can't say I'm upset by it.
But another reason, and this is where I realize this is maybe a flawed argument, is what it does to families when their loved ones murderer is NOT sentenced to death. I know that there have been studies and talks on how sentencing the murderer to death isn't guaranteed to bring healing to the families. But I've also watched high profile cases where life without parole is imposed instead of death, and the families of the victims feeling as if their loved one's killer life is valued over their loved one. And of course I'm not saying that that is what the juries in those cases felt, but that's how it felt to the families. That the life of the killer was considered more valuable than the life of the victim.
Its different in cases where LWOP is the only option. I've seen victim impact for both the Wisconsin Christmas parade murders and the Club Q murders, and while I believe some families stated that they wished that the death penalty was an option, the fact that its not on the table in those states meant that they knew their loved one's killer received the toughest punishment, and they weren't left feeling as if their pain was being ignored or denied.
Again, I'm not connected on a personal way to this issue, and I can't and won't speak for anyone who is.
Anyways for a whole host of reasons, I think we as a country and a society would be better off without a death penalty across the board.
another reason, these mass murderers take so much and i don't want to give them anything including attention - good or bad. ensure they have a fair trial, and that everyone's basic human rights are protected in prison, otherwise deny them any and every bit of publicity and notoriety and fame. focus our attention we would be focusing on them and their death sentence (whether one is for or against it) on their victims. Focus on their lives that were cut short, their passions, dreams, complexities. Take the money that would be used for death row appeals and use it to pay victim compensation and towards community services and preventive services. provide long time support for families of the victims, and the family of the perpetrator as well.
His diplomas from Harvard mean nothing, as is the case now for all Harvard diplomas. His diploma from Claremont, though, certifies that he's an asshole.
The best part about Biden not pardoning Roof or Bowers is that if the orange shitgibbon wants to kill someone it'll have to be someone who is a racist/misogynist just like himself.
Ta, Robyn. I look forward to the day when there's no such thing as Death Row. It may not happen in my lifetime, but a woman can hope. Thank you, President Biden.
And just for gravy, it deprives Trump of the sadistic pleasure he was SO looking forward to. After he'd signed all those juicy death warrants he'd probably have been so turned on he'd have gone looking for a porn star sufficiently lacking in class (mind you, I think Stormy Daniels has enormously more class than Trump does) to bonk him at this stage of his career. Hope the news makes him miserable.
Whatever you think of the death penalty in the abstract, the "family members of those who were killed" leniency argument is never a good one for terroristic mass muderers, whose crimes *by definition* are not only against those who were killed.
Awhile ago, I was called for the jury pool for a home-invasion/murder case. It was the Arivaca, Arizona case where these jackasses in a terrorist group calling itself the “Minutemen Militia” decided to fund their operations by breaking into a house that allegedly had drugs and stealing same.
Well, it wasn’t a drug house. There were three people at home: a mother and father and their young daughter. The assailants shot and killed the father and daughter; the mother was wounded too but shot back and the assailants fled. They were soon found, arrested and charged with various crimes including murder.
The jury pool for which I was called was for the trial of triggerman John Bush. And I swear to D-g I have never been so close to unrepentant evil as I was that day. I was with a friend who was called, too, and she was completely freaked out. The room was COLD and the murderer sat silently in the box, blank eyes staring into nothing. As the attorneys read instructions to the jury, at least one person stood and yelled, “what are we waiting for? Just fry him!” and there was much agreement.
Neither my friend nor I were chosen to serve. And the thing is: I am opposed to the death penalty in the abstract. I know how it’s used more often against people of color and the poor and how it’s never a deterrent. I believe that society cannot pretend to be opposed to murder while using murder as a punishment. And had I been chosen, and had I agreed with the prosecution’s case, I would have had no choice but to vote to convict and sentence Bush to die.
But I did not, and do not, want him to die by the hand of the state. I wanted him to be sentenced to solitary for the remainder of his long life, with one specific condition: that a photograph of the little girl he murdered be placed on his cell wall, with a light to illuminate it at night, so he’d be forced to see her face day and night and to contemplate why she needed to die and he got to live.
I don’t believe in angels or in hell or any of that. I want him to suffer in the worst way, in this life. Seeing her smiling face looking at him all the time would surely break him. Good.
I just want to say that I can't truly imagine, even as I try, and even as you put it into such visceral and clear words, the trauma of just serving, or going through the voir dire process like you and your friend did, was. I'm really sorry about that. I'm really sorry you experienced that type of evil and cruelty up close.
As awful as this may sound, most people live in the abstract world I mentioned. Actually seeing the evil up close is sometimes necessary to recalibrate your senses -- YES, this shit actually exists and we cannot forgot it or hide it away. We need to confront it.
There's only one reason Leonard Peltier is still behind bars—because he is guilty beyond any doubt and thoroughly unrepentant. That's why no president including President Obama has seen fit to endorse Peltier’s manufactured persona as a "human rights activist." The evidence against Peltier is overwhelming. His boast of how he murdered FBI Agent Ronald Williams matched the autopsy report, “The motherf---er was begging for his life but I shot him anyway,” as recalled under oath in 2004 by KaMook Nichols, the former common-law wife of AIM founder Dennis Banks. At the 1974 AIM gathering in Farmington, NM, Peltier interrogated future AIM murder victim Anna Mae Pictou Aquash by putting a loaded gun in her mouth calling it “truth serum.” Her murder is the subject of a DocuSeries now streaming on Hulu. And as documented in the historical exposé, American Indian Mafia, Peltier's vanity project has only served to fool millions of trusting fans and denigrate the legacy of genuine political prisoners and authentic Indian warriors.
Punishment. Some thoughts
https://eidie.substack.com/p/penalty
"Victims' Rights" advocates typically overlook those victims like the ones you mention, Marcie, who plead for the merciful side of justice in excluding the death penalty from being applied to those who brought them so much pain.
The media drumbeat that "closure" and "justice" can only be obtained by an Old-West-Style hangin' in the public square has overwhelmed the better angels of our nature.
Trump is perfectly within his authority to commute Rooff, Tsarnaeve and Bowers if he wants to. I think it's brilliant of Biden to leave these guys for Trump to have to deal with.
It's a lovely conundrum, too; does he execute Roof and Bowers, knowing that his MAGA constituency is big fans of them both?
My thoughts exactly.
Been there...a boyfriend picked it up off the floor at a Dr John concert and threw it upwards in my face...@$$...
The concept of pulling the death sentence rug out from under Trump is delicious....I'd not thought of it that way. Now Trump can go the extra mile, and say he really sympathizes with the other three who are guilty of such horrible crimes so he'll out-mercy Biden and pardon them...because he really believes in the rule of law....and Mark Milley....
Tsarnaev is probably fucked, being all Muslimy. The other two killed blacks and Jews.
Pack our bags, boys. Presidential pardons a-comin'.
Thank God.
"There has got be consequences," says Sir, oblivious to irony.
This might not make any sense, and its something that I haven't seen mentioned before, so maybe what I'm going to say is really flawed. I'm against the death penalty across the board primarily for reasons of the chance of an innocent person being executed, its racist distribution and bias. I wouldn't be a death qualified jury (for one reason my state doesn't have capital punishment) but otherwise I don't think I could make that decision to sentence another person to death. On the other hand, when someone like McVeigh is sentenced to death I can't say I'm upset by it.
But another reason, and this is where I realize this is maybe a flawed argument, is what it does to families when their loved ones murderer is NOT sentenced to death. I know that there have been studies and talks on how sentencing the murderer to death isn't guaranteed to bring healing to the families. But I've also watched high profile cases where life without parole is imposed instead of death, and the families of the victims feeling as if their loved one's killer life is valued over their loved one. And of course I'm not saying that that is what the juries in those cases felt, but that's how it felt to the families. That the life of the killer was considered more valuable than the life of the victim.
Its different in cases where LWOP is the only option. I've seen victim impact for both the Wisconsin Christmas parade murders and the Club Q murders, and while I believe some families stated that they wished that the death penalty was an option, the fact that its not on the table in those states meant that they knew their loved one's killer received the toughest punishment, and they weren't left feeling as if their pain was being ignored or denied.
Again, I'm not connected on a personal way to this issue, and I can't and won't speak for anyone who is.
Anyways for a whole host of reasons, I think we as a country and a society would be better off without a death penalty across the board.
I quite agree with everything you said.
another reason, these mass murderers take so much and i don't want to give them anything including attention - good or bad. ensure they have a fair trial, and that everyone's basic human rights are protected in prison, otherwise deny them any and every bit of publicity and notoriety and fame. focus our attention we would be focusing on them and their death sentence (whether one is for or against it) on their victims. Focus on their lives that were cut short, their passions, dreams, complexities. Take the money that would be used for death row appeals and use it to pay victim compensation and towards community services and preventive services. provide long time support for families of the victims, and the family of the perpetrator as well.
Which incompetent attorney doesn't know the difference between a pardon and a commutation? The answer won't surprise you!
https://x.com/SenTomCotton/status/1871243690418569347
His diplomas from Harvard mean nothing, as is the case now for all Harvard diplomas. His diploma from Claremont, though, certifies that he's an asshole.
Yep wasn't surprised.
The best part about Biden not pardoning Roof or Bowers is that if the orange shitgibbon wants to kill someone it'll have to be someone who is a racist/misogynist just like himself.
Ta, Robyn. I look forward to the day when there's no such thing as Death Row. It may not happen in my lifetime, but a woman can hope. Thank you, President Biden.
And just for gravy, it deprives Trump of the sadistic pleasure he was SO looking forward to. After he'd signed all those juicy death warrants he'd probably have been so turned on he'd have gone looking for a porn star sufficiently lacking in class (mind you, I think Stormy Daniels has enormously more class than Trump does) to bonk him at this stage of his career. Hope the news makes him miserable.
He'll ask his SCROTUS buddies to let him do it anyway. The twisted logic devised by those hacks will violate all of knot theory.
Watch: li'l don will pardon the two white supremacists.
That'll show Joe.
In all likelihood, yes.
Whatever you think of the death penalty in the abstract, the "family members of those who were killed" leniency argument is never a good one for terroristic mass muderers, whose crimes *by definition* are not only against those who were killed.
Awhile ago, I was called for the jury pool for a home-invasion/murder case. It was the Arivaca, Arizona case where these jackasses in a terrorist group calling itself the “Minutemen Militia” decided to fund their operations by breaking into a house that allegedly had drugs and stealing same.
Well, it wasn’t a drug house. There were three people at home: a mother and father and their young daughter. The assailants shot and killed the father and daughter; the mother was wounded too but shot back and the assailants fled. They were soon found, arrested and charged with various crimes including murder.
The jury pool for which I was called was for the trial of triggerman John Bush. And I swear to D-g I have never been so close to unrepentant evil as I was that day. I was with a friend who was called, too, and she was completely freaked out. The room was COLD and the murderer sat silently in the box, blank eyes staring into nothing. As the attorneys read instructions to the jury, at least one person stood and yelled, “what are we waiting for? Just fry him!” and there was much agreement.
Neither my friend nor I were chosen to serve. And the thing is: I am opposed to the death penalty in the abstract. I know how it’s used more often against people of color and the poor and how it’s never a deterrent. I believe that society cannot pretend to be opposed to murder while using murder as a punishment. And had I been chosen, and had I agreed with the prosecution’s case, I would have had no choice but to vote to convict and sentence Bush to die.
But I did not, and do not, want him to die by the hand of the state. I wanted him to be sentenced to solitary for the remainder of his long life, with one specific condition: that a photograph of the little girl he murdered be placed on his cell wall, with a light to illuminate it at night, so he’d be forced to see her face day and night and to contemplate why she needed to die and he got to live.
I don’t believe in angels or in hell or any of that. I want him to suffer in the worst way, in this life. Seeing her smiling face looking at him all the time would surely break him. Good.
I just want to say that I can't truly imagine, even as I try, and even as you put it into such visceral and clear words, the trauma of just serving, or going through the voir dire process like you and your friend did, was. I'm really sorry about that. I'm really sorry you experienced that type of evil and cruelty up close.
As awful as this may sound, most people live in the abstract world I mentioned. Actually seeing the evil up close is sometimes necessary to recalibrate your senses -- YES, this shit actually exists and we cannot forgot it or hide it away. We need to confront it.
Link to case here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murders_of_Raul_and_Brisenia_Flores