When I was a young man fucking around at West Valley Junior College, --I'm 68!-- in Saratoga, CA, I paid $11.00 per Semester. You heard that correctly. $22.00. Per. Year. When I got to my CSU three years later (I was unfocused shut up) there was no tuition, just "fees" to the tune of $71.00 per quarter (they were on the q-system then, later switched to the s-system) so 3 quarters per year = $213.00 per year. My big, thick biology book at the JC cost me $9.40 used. By the time I graduated with my credential in 2009 (like I said: unfocused) the same CSU (which is now a "Polytechnic", but that's a whole 'nother story) was $5000.00/year. My Teaching Kids How to Read book was just over a hundred bucks. So now I am that rare breed of Boomer who has a ton of student loan debt. I did teach at a Title I school for 3 years, so that should count for something.
So... this all Raygun's or Noxions fault, I forget which, but T. Hartmann laid it all out as to how and why he/they did that.
Damn. My elite-ish alma mater of UC San Diego charged about $600 a quarter for a full load of classes and I had a grant the first year, worked all of the four years I was there plus two summers, and graduated with no debt (I am an Old). I’m sure that UCSD, which expects to have 40,000 students at some point, will find themselves hard pressed to accept more. I don’t have kids but am happy my taxes are paying for more people to be educated because I want to love among educated people.
When we take children from their parents — and unlike many on the Left, I am not against that, having raised a child who was! — we have a responsibility to them. This is so obvious to me I don’t even know how to expand that thought. Kids in foster care usually do not have awesome lives, which I am going to leave undetailed here.
Yeah, I couldn’t remember which one of those two it was (last read Catch-22, probably, 45-50 years ago). DeCoverly also maintained a scorecard of “black eyes” and “feathers in a hat”, didn’t he?
Lucky you ran into me! I have been prepping it intensively for my students since last spring and all summer. De Coverley had the clear eye-patch, and it was actually Colonel Cathcart who had the "eyes" and "feathers." Not sure what I will do with Milo Minderbinder's practice of free markets!
I have, apparently, several characters confused in the mists of my memory. I’m pretty sure I remember accurately that Major Major Major Major get his name from a father with a weird sense of humor and a Congress ional Act creating, just for him, the rank of “Major Major”.
This will vary a little by discipline, but I, and many others, have made reading available for free since COVID (before, I made paper readers that set students back a whole $20 or so). I buy the books, I walk to Kinko's, I pay for the scans. I also write my own manuals for the stats software we use. The downside is that the vast majority of students do not do their assigned reading anymore. But yes. Education should be accessible. Especially now that enrollment has been dropping.
when i was a young boomer in MI, CA was the model educational system … glad to see gov. newsom bringing back some of the luster … free school pays off in the long run in increased tax revenue … CA’s economy is an intended consequence of this model still … forward into the past !
Starting in 1968 Calif. Gov. Ronald Reagan fought to impose tuition at California's four year colleges. I always believed it was an act of petulance aimed at punishing the UC's and CSU's for the "permissiveness" that allowed the schools to be the epicenters of student protest. The state legislature thwarted his initial efforts. Eventually RR managed to get the legies to go along with charges that were called "student registration fees" instead of tuition. But that was the beginning of the ride down the slippery slope. This is GovGav turning back the clock a bit on the Reagan Junta years.
I'm not following the California community college landscape very closely, but a few years ago they seemed to be accepting out-of-state and foreign students at a pretty high rate so they could collect more Amero money-bucks. I often wondered if California students were getting screwed when it came time to transfer to an in-state four year CSUs and UCs, which are being run like corporations. There seemed to be a high rate of foreign students and out-of-staters who may have been displacing native Californians. I'm not sure where I read this.
When I was in high school, there were several teachers who bemoaned the fact that they could not afford to be students any longer. They were lifelong learners and were taking classes at UC for free. The Horror! Sounded cool to me, but that ended by the time I hit college. At least I benefited from the knowledge they passed on to me.
I teach at a CSU, and yes, before COVID, they were recruiting heavily in especially Asia to charge students a fortune. Those students did not replace native Californians--the years 2000-2020 were years of overall growth of the student population. It always bugged me though. Many of them did not speak English at all, and I never understood what they got out of it, other than c minuses. It's not like a CSU is going to look super impressive on one's resume. Plus, the stated mission of the CSU system is to provide affordable higher education to CA residents, so.
Thanks for sharing the CSU info and making that clear that Californians are not being displaced. One of my kids roomed with a bunch of Asian nationals who were all trying to get into a UC. The whole apartment building was full of them. It was a great experience for him, but the rents were completely outrageous (Bay Area of course). My oldest kid went to a UC and had a Chinese roommate who was a Japanese major. I couldn't figure out why he came to the U.S. to study Japanese. He was also a video gamer who stayed up late to play tournaments in Asia and probably paid his tuition that way. Maybe he needed to know Japanese for better paying tournaments. Who knows?
It was a well-known fact during my CSU graduate school years that the fairly large block of foreign students banded together to share notes and exam questions. And many were here because they wanted to stay and work in the U.S. They also stood out because, while most of us had full-time jobs, they did not. There was at least one instance of coordinated cheating from a group of Asian students, but we all benefitted because the professor reworked the test and most of us improved our scores.
While my kid is not a foster, he just had an appointment with an advisor at a California community college. He was told that tuition was free this semester. This is the kind of retrograde "back to the good old days" I like to see.
Around here (Bay Area) most, if not all of them, are free. If they are going to be allowed to hand out bachelor's degrees, as they want, the CSU is toast. Most of our students are transfers from community colleges as it is, and I don't blame them.
I thought the BA degrees were just for certain majors. My kid is enrolling in a Bay Area CC and is shooting for the UC track. Sounds like the whole state system is being shaken up and disrupted. Now if Calif. can only get its housing crisis sorted out...
As far as I know, community colleges only do associate's degrees so far around here--this is why we get so many transfer students. After CC, CSU or UC are pretty interchangeable, but both are accessible to transfer students, with certain requirements like GPA. UC is more expensive, but not always worth it, depending on campus and major.
Brief comment about housing: this nonsense has got to burst at some point. I bought my house in 2010 for a bag of change, and now the "Zestimate" (I know, not a great source) is almost half a million dollars. There is not all that much reason to the housing market. Except it would be good to have some more housing. And in general, yes, it does feel like CA is figuring things out. We (CSU) deal with a lot of last-minute-temporary-panic decisions. It's led to shitty things (students are now fully seen as customers) and also good things (affordable education). We'll see.
Before I entered foster care, life was a shit sammich. I got sent to a pretty awesome group foster home, which was great for the time I was there, but once I aged out I got fed to the sharks. I headed for the hills and carved out a "life", of sorts. School was never an option for me, either economically or academically. All the best to the ones we're gonna help now, they'll need it.
Shouldn't these top 10 colleges/universities be providing free education for qualifying students? After all, it's not like they're hurting for funding!
10 National Universities With the Biggest Endowments
Endowments at these schools range from about $14 billion to $53 billion, U.S. News data shows.
B-b-but how could they afford to do *that* and keep paying administration and the president their salaries?! There's only so cheap you can go and still get a good hard-working adjunct, you know! And you can't raise tuition for the legacy kids, after all! That would be discrimination!
When I was a young (45-ish) starry-eyed Sonoma State student in 2006, I was assured there was no "tuition" at Cali's state colleges, but the (now quaint) $1,800 per semester was "fees"... We stupid students didn't seem to grasp the difference since we had to pay it anyway (and if we didn't I think they had plans that included Bebe Jeebus and some spikey dildos)...
i approve wholeheartedly - for what its worth
This kind of communism has been going on in Oregon for some time now. About time it spread.
When I was a young man fucking around at West Valley Junior College, --I'm 68!-- in Saratoga, CA, I paid $11.00 per Semester. You heard that correctly. $22.00. Per. Year. When I got to my CSU three years later (I was unfocused shut up) there was no tuition, just "fees" to the tune of $71.00 per quarter (they were on the q-system then, later switched to the s-system) so 3 quarters per year = $213.00 per year. My big, thick biology book at the JC cost me $9.40 used. By the time I graduated with my credential in 2009 (like I said: unfocused) the same CSU (which is now a "Polytechnic", but that's a whole 'nother story) was $5000.00/year. My Teaching Kids How to Read book was just over a hundred bucks. So now I am that rare breed of Boomer who has a ton of student loan debt. I did teach at a Title I school for 3 years, so that should count for something.
So... this all Raygun's or Noxions fault, I forget which, but T. Hartmann laid it all out as to how and why he/they did that.
I am my brother’s keeper. Jesus said it. Good enough for me. Give everybody eat and roof.
Damn. My elite-ish alma mater of UC San Diego charged about $600 a quarter for a full load of classes and I had a grant the first year, worked all of the four years I was there plus two summers, and graduated with no debt (I am an Old). I’m sure that UCSD, which expects to have 40,000 students at some point, will find themselves hard pressed to accept more. I don’t have kids but am happy my taxes are paying for more people to be educated because I want to love among educated people.
When we take children from their parents — and unlike many on the Left, I am not against that, having raised a child who was! — we have a responsibility to them. This is so obvious to me I don’t even know how to expand that thought. Kids in foster care usually do not have awesome lives, which I am going to leave undetailed here.
a 100 upvotes for this - thank you RS -
“Gimme eat!” ordered General Dreedle.
It was Major ________ de Coverley, actually, but I get you!
Yeah, I couldn’t remember which one of those two it was (last read Catch-22, probably, 45-50 years ago). DeCoverly also maintained a scorecard of “black eyes” and “feathers in a hat”, didn’t he?
Lucky you ran into me! I have been prepping it intensively for my students since last spring and all summer. De Coverley had the clear eye-patch, and it was actually Colonel Cathcart who had the "eyes" and "feathers." Not sure what I will do with Milo Minderbinder's practice of free markets!
It's a great book for our times!
I have, apparently, several characters confused in the mists of my memory. I’m pretty sure I remember accurately that Major Major Major Major get his name from a father with a weird sense of humor and a Congress ional Act creating, just for him, the rank of “Major Major”.
Col. Cathcart tried to promote him to LTC once but they had only one Major Major Major Major, and they were not going to lose him through promotion.
I am really going to enjoy reading it with my students.
This will vary a little by discipline, but I, and many others, have made reading available for free since COVID (before, I made paper readers that set students back a whole $20 or so). I buy the books, I walk to Kinko's, I pay for the scans. I also write my own manuals for the stats software we use. The downside is that the vast majority of students do not do their assigned reading anymore. But yes. Education should be accessible. Especially now that enrollment has been dropping.
when i was a young boomer in MI, CA was the model educational system … glad to see gov. newsom bringing back some of the luster … free school pays off in the long run in increased tax revenue … CA’s economy is an intended consequence of this model still … forward into the past !
Starting in 1968 Calif. Gov. Ronald Reagan fought to impose tuition at California's four year colleges. I always believed it was an act of petulance aimed at punishing the UC's and CSU's for the "permissiveness" that allowed the schools to be the epicenters of student protest. The state legislature thwarted his initial efforts. Eventually RR managed to get the legies to go along with charges that were called "student registration fees" instead of tuition. But that was the beginning of the ride down the slippery slope. This is GovGav turning back the clock a bit on the Reagan Junta years.
Permissive students yes, but they are at heart extremely conservative organizations.
He didn't want to fund education for the "hippies" who wouldn't vote for him.
Republicans hate educated people.
I, an educated person, hate Republicans.
I'm not following the California community college landscape very closely, but a few years ago they seemed to be accepting out-of-state and foreign students at a pretty high rate so they could collect more Amero money-bucks. I often wondered if California students were getting screwed when it came time to transfer to an in-state four year CSUs and UCs, which are being run like corporations. There seemed to be a high rate of foreign students and out-of-staters who may have been displacing native Californians. I'm not sure where I read this.
When I was in high school, there were several teachers who bemoaned the fact that they could not afford to be students any longer. They were lifelong learners and were taking classes at UC for free. The Horror! Sounded cool to me, but that ended by the time I hit college. At least I benefited from the knowledge they passed on to me.
I teach at a CSU, and yes, before COVID, they were recruiting heavily in especially Asia to charge students a fortune. Those students did not replace native Californians--the years 2000-2020 were years of overall growth of the student population. It always bugged me though. Many of them did not speak English at all, and I never understood what they got out of it, other than c minuses. It's not like a CSU is going to look super impressive on one's resume. Plus, the stated mission of the CSU system is to provide affordable higher education to CA residents, so.
Thanks for sharing the CSU info and making that clear that Californians are not being displaced. One of my kids roomed with a bunch of Asian nationals who were all trying to get into a UC. The whole apartment building was full of them. It was a great experience for him, but the rents were completely outrageous (Bay Area of course). My oldest kid went to a UC and had a Chinese roommate who was a Japanese major. I couldn't figure out why he came to the U.S. to study Japanese. He was also a video gamer who stayed up late to play tournaments in Asia and probably paid his tuition that way. Maybe he needed to know Japanese for better paying tournaments. Who knows?
It was a well-known fact during my CSU graduate school years that the fairly large block of foreign students banded together to share notes and exam questions. And many were here because they wanted to stay and work in the U.S. They also stood out because, while most of us had full-time jobs, they did not. There was at least one instance of coordinated cheating from a group of Asian students, but we all benefitted because the professor reworked the test and most of us improved our scores.
While my kid is not a foster, he just had an appointment with an advisor at a California community college. He was told that tuition was free this semester. This is the kind of retrograde "back to the good old days" I like to see.
Around here (Bay Area) most, if not all of them, are free. If they are going to be allowed to hand out bachelor's degrees, as they want, the CSU is toast. Most of our students are transfers from community colleges as it is, and I don't blame them.
I thought the BA degrees were just for certain majors. My kid is enrolling in a Bay Area CC and is shooting for the UC track. Sounds like the whole state system is being shaken up and disrupted. Now if Calif. can only get its housing crisis sorted out...
As far as I know, community colleges only do associate's degrees so far around here--this is why we get so many transfer students. After CC, CSU or UC are pretty interchangeable, but both are accessible to transfer students, with certain requirements like GPA. UC is more expensive, but not always worth it, depending on campus and major.
Brief comment about housing: this nonsense has got to burst at some point. I bought my house in 2010 for a bag of change, and now the "Zestimate" (I know, not a great source) is almost half a million dollars. There is not all that much reason to the housing market. Except it would be good to have some more housing. And in general, yes, it does feel like CA is figuring things out. We (CSU) deal with a lot of last-minute-temporary-panic decisions. It's led to shitty things (students are now fully seen as customers) and also good things (affordable education). We'll see.
Before I entered foster care, life was a shit sammich. I got sent to a pretty awesome group foster home, which was great for the time I was there, but once I aged out I got fed to the sharks. I headed for the hills and carved out a "life", of sorts. School was never an option for me, either economically or academically. All the best to the ones we're gonna help now, they'll need it.
Shouldn't these top 10 colleges/universities be providing free education for qualifying students? After all, it's not like they're hurting for funding!
10 National Universities With the Biggest Endowments
Endowments at these schools range from about $14 billion to $53 billion, U.S. News data shows.
https://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/the-short-list-college/articles/10-universities-with-the-biggest-endowments#:~:text=Topping%20the%20list%20at%20about,News%20in%20an%20annual%20survey.
B-b-but how could they afford to do *that* and keep paying administration and the president their salaries?! There's only so cheap you can go and still get a good hard-working adjunct, you know! And you can't raise tuition for the legacy kids, after all! That would be discrimination!
When I was a young (45-ish) starry-eyed Sonoma State student in 2006, I was assured there was no "tuition" at Cali's state colleges, but the (now quaint) $1,800 per semester was "fees"... We stupid students didn't seem to grasp the difference since we had to pay it anyway (and if we didn't I think they had plans that included Bebe Jeebus and some spikey dildos)...
Cheaper to pay for their college than to pay for all the social services they'd wind up needing, right?
Lord knows they probably need social services too. Most foster kids face trauma after trauma through their entire stay in the system.