It will forever be astonishing to me that the same people who believe they need to have personal arsenals to fight a tyrannical government are supportive of granting that same government explicit power to kill its own citizens.
"Closure" is a myth, as almost any family member of a victim has come to learn, often the long and hard way, after a trial where the prosecution (and often the media) promised them "justice" and "closure" and "resolution" our system cannot deliver.
One loss cannot be repaired by taking another life. We must get out of the business of killing people in service of a fantasy.
They were likely pressured to accept a lower standard than "beyond a reasonable doubt" by the prosecution. The last time I was called for jury duty I was dismissed because I refused to give testimony equal weight as physical evidence. In a case where there was no physical evidence at all, or even any witnesses besides the victim and defendant.
The death penalty in the United States is just a form of human sacrifice but where we took out all the fun things like volcanos and naked blood orgies.
The death penalty in a nutshell: state-sanctioned murder because murder is wrong. Until we have a flawless justice system (and we never will) the death penalty is just that, state-sanctioned murder. Full stop. You only have to look at its most ardent supporters to come to that conclusion too.
Oh yeah I see how Hicks felt so comfortable. Mr. Johnson is very obviously a Black man and aren't we all big and scary and guilty? I'm sure that even self-haters (given the demographics of Jefferson County, Hicks herself may probably be Black) can see that.
This is America! And of course he was put away in an unreconstructed state, with an unreconstructed administration. The unreconstructed governor has a fetish for capital punishment, so...all I can say is God help this man.
Iโm sorry, but I really have to question how freaking naive people are. Even as a dumb teenager(or at least I wouldโve been at the time) who still had a fairly rose tinted glasses view of law enforcement in general, I wouldโve questioned a case where the only evidence given was one person hearing a three way call where the defendant supposedly confessed. I know some prosecutors worry jury members expect too much in the way of evidence, but really? Whatโs even more insane is how the defense attorney somehow couldnโt overcome the nothing that convicted his client.
Funny enough, I'd say I'm ok with the death penalty in exactly one case, it just happens that it is rarely applicable. I'm definitely not ok with the death penalty in any scenario in which there is *any* doubt at all - totally fine with it (in the abstract) in the case where a guy, for instance, walks into a building and starts shooting, there are a jillion witnesses, the whole thing was caught on a dozen cameras, and there is absolutely no question that he did what he did. Just that, well, for good or bad, such people usually end up resolving the question for themselves relatively immediately thereafter...
I'd also take it out of the hands of individual states, and reserve the matter of execution to the federal government. State courts can *recommend* the death penalty, but it's up to the federal DoJ to make the final determination and carry out the sentence.
Especially since individual states can't even seem to manage to execute someone without messing things up.
It's just so astonishing to me that the justice system can't seem to codify a standard of evidence that precludes the death penalty for the innocent or possibly innocent. The scenario you suggest would meet that standard. So would overwhelming physical evidence - like bodies under the floorboards, or motive+means+opportunity+DNA.
But... nope! Too hard to implement common damn sense, it would appear.
Bodies under the floorboard definitely wouldn't, in my mind, meet that criteria by itself. What's to stop someone from digging up someone else's floorboards while they're out on vacation? Nothing. :D
That's how I feel. Spree shooters caught during the rampage and I would add terrorists like the OKC bomber. But yeah, air tight with no mitigating factors or circumstantial evidence
>>I find it confusing that Hicks says she and the other jurors were not aware that there was no physical evidence, because one would assume that if there were it would have been presented at trial.<<
Robyn, I can clear up any confusion you might have with two simple words: Alabama. Jury.
It will forever be astonishing to me that the same people who believe they need to have personal arsenals to fight a tyrannical government are supportive of granting that same government explicit power to kill its own citizens.
"Closure" is a myth, as almost any family member of a victim has come to learn, often the long and hard way, after a trial where the prosecution (and often the media) promised them "justice" and "closure" and "resolution" our system cannot deliver.
One loss cannot be repaired by taking another life. We must get out of the business of killing people in service of a fantasy.
Ta, Robyn. State sanctioned murder is still murder.
๐ต๐๐, ๐ฐ ๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐: ๐ฐ ๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐ ๐๐โ๐ ๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐ฏ๐๐๐๐ ๐๐ ๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐ ๐๐ ๐ ๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐๐ ๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐ ๐๐ ๐โ๐ ๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐ ๐ ๐ ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐. ๐ฐ ๐ ๐๐โ๐ ๐๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐๐ โ๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐ ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐ ๐๐๐๐.โ
They were likely pressured to accept a lower standard than "beyond a reasonable doubt" by the prosecution. The last time I was called for jury duty I was dismissed because I refused to give testimony equal weight as physical evidence. In a case where there was no physical evidence at all, or even any witnesses besides the victim and defendant.
The death penalty in the United States is just a form of human sacrifice but where we took out all the fun things like volcanos and naked blood orgies.
The death penalty in a nutshell: state-sanctioned murder because murder is wrong. Until we have a flawless justice system (and we never will) the death penalty is just that, state-sanctioned murder. Full stop. You only have to look at its most ardent supporters to come to that conclusion too.
And an expensive process.
Thanks alito.
Oh yeah I see how Hicks felt so comfortable. Mr. Johnson is very obviously a Black man and aren't we all big and scary and guilty? I'm sure that even self-haters (given the demographics of Jefferson County, Hicks herself may probably be Black) can see that.
This is America! And of course he was put away in an unreconstructed state, with an unreconstructed administration. The unreconstructed governor has a fetish for capital punishment, so...all I can say is God help this man.
Iโm sorry, but I really have to question how freaking naive people are. Even as a dumb teenager(or at least I wouldโve been at the time) who still had a fairly rose tinted glasses view of law enforcement in general, I wouldโve questioned a case where the only evidence given was one person hearing a three way call where the defendant supposedly confessed. I know some prosecutors worry jury members expect too much in the way of evidence, but really? Whatโs even more insane is how the defense attorney somehow couldnโt overcome the nothing that convicted his client.
Was none of this disclosed to his defense attorney? I can't imagine that the defense wouldn't at least check out the alibi witnesses
Funny enough, I'd say I'm ok with the death penalty in exactly one case, it just happens that it is rarely applicable. I'm definitely not ok with the death penalty in any scenario in which there is *any* doubt at all - totally fine with it (in the abstract) in the case where a guy, for instance, walks into a building and starts shooting, there are a jillion witnesses, the whole thing was caught on a dozen cameras, and there is absolutely no question that he did what he did. Just that, well, for good or bad, such people usually end up resolving the question for themselves relatively immediately thereafter...
I'd also take it out of the hands of individual states, and reserve the matter of execution to the federal government. State courts can *recommend* the death penalty, but it's up to the federal DoJ to make the final determination and carry out the sentence.
Especially since individual states can't even seem to manage to execute someone without messing things up.
It's just so astonishing to me that the justice system can't seem to codify a standard of evidence that precludes the death penalty for the innocent or possibly innocent. The scenario you suggest would meet that standard. So would overwhelming physical evidence - like bodies under the floorboards, or motive+means+opportunity+DNA.
But... nope! Too hard to implement common damn sense, it would appear.
Bodies under the floorboard definitely wouldn't, in my mind, meet that criteria by itself. What's to stop someone from digging up someone else's floorboards while they're out on vacation? Nothing. :D
That's how I feel. Spree shooters caught during the rampage and I would add terrorists like the OKC bomber. But yeah, air tight with no mitigating factors or circumstantial evidence
>>I find it confusing that Hicks says she and the other jurors were not aware that there was no physical evidence, because one would assume that if there were it would have been presented at trial.<<
Robyn, I can clear up any confusion you might have with two simple words: Alabama. Jury.
OT, but it sounds like Pecker really hurt trump. Exposed all the uglies, catch and kill, payoffs, evidence the election was their motivation.
The accusations are being systematically substantiated and their miscreant motivation made manifest.
And there isn't a damned thing that the Deposed Despot can do about it.
nice!
ah yes! Jefferson County. Birmingham, Alabama is famously the least racist place in the entire US of A.
[winces with pain/shrieks damning profanities at Cat the Ripper/limps out to kitchen medicine cabinet for antiseptic and a bandage]
๐ ๐๐ ๐๐๐ข๐ฅ๐๐ ๐ญ๐จ ๐ฌ๐๐๐ซ๐๐ก '๐ก๐ข๐๐๐๐ง ๐ซ๐จ๐จ๐ฆ' ๐๐ญ ๐๐๐ซ-๐-๐๐๐ ๐จ โ ๐๐๐๐จ๐ซ๐๐ข๐ง๐ ๐ญ๐จ ๐๐ซ๐ฎ๐ฆ๐ฉ'๐ฌ ๐จ๐ฐ๐ง
Accidentally, or....
I ask because it seems like FBI 101 is teaching agents how to search things.