Point of order: the Battle of Midway was not part of a US "offensive," the Japanese attacked Midway and the US fended them off. It was a major victory, but technically not an offensive, I think.
FDR was a socialist surrounded by communists who went to Europe to save Marxism? I would love to hear Robinson define "socialist," "communist," and "Marxism." Hell, for that matter, I'd like to see him point out Europe on a globe.
Not exactly a conspiracy but merely a theory: the US invested much, much more in the war in Europe because Europeans are "white" people, and most in the Pacific are not. Heck,, if you notice, in movies about the civilians in the Pacific War, they center on imperialist planters or missionaries or other colonial types, not on the colonized.
Occam's razor says we had long-time allies and therefore bases in Europe close to Germany and the Pacific is big and more complicated geographically. Your theory (not in the scientific sense) may have had some influence, though.
Well, yes, you can put it that way... Europe being more "like us" in general, though to say that the assumption that western Europe was what defined "civilization" didn't factor into US policy would be absurd. The US was quite willing to support Fascists in, say, "kinda European" Latin America (Brazil was both a fascist country, and a member of the Allies) as long as they kept their place in the "world order" of the time.
This baloney about FDR knowing that Japan was going to attack Pearl Harbor and letting it happen so he could justify declaring war is a VERY OLD CONSPIRACY THEORY. I studied this in my International Relations courses in college in the mid 70's, and it wasn't a new idea even then.
"And this drawing shows the Pilgrims' submarine surfacing near Plymouth Rock as the deck gunner takes out a gathering of curious Wampanoag tribal elders."
To Mark "CrazyMotherFucker" Robinson on his statement that even though Japan attacked the US at Pearl Harbor, but most of the effort went to the war in Europe, the thousands of men who fought and died in the Pacific, their families and loved ones, would love to have a word. Another cowardly idiot.
Coral Sea was purely defensive, but Midway not so much. Code breaks led the United States to know what was afoot and Nimitz dispatched his three carriers not to defend Midway per se,, but specifically to ambush the Japanese carriers. Successful performance of that ambush did result in Japan calling off the invasion of Midway, but Nimitz had also specifically given his admirals permission to call off the attack and let Midway fend for itself if they felt there was no opportunity to inflict greater damage upon the Japanese than they themselves would suffer. The Japanese carriers were the target of a defensive-offensive operation, with Midway itself ultimately expendable if it came to that.
Dok, hate to contradict you, but Coral Sea and Midway were defensive operations, to stop Japanese seaborne invasions of Port Moresby and Midway Island, respectively. Nimitz even used the phrase "fleet opposed invasion" in his orders. Operation Watchtower, the invasion of Guadalcanal in August 1942 was the first American offensive. Almost exactly one month later, Operation Torch, the landings on Vichy French colonial holdings in North Africa in support of the North African campaign was the first operation against Germany and it's allies.
Ironically, in another timeline, Torch probably would have happened first. Guadalcanal was a rush job, thrown together when intelligence discovered that Japan was moving to establish strong bases in the southern Solomons, with the intention of cutting Australia off from the U.S. If we had discovered that later, a larger and more fully prepared counteroffensive would have been required, which would have taken longer to put together. It might have had to wait until the first couple of Essex Class carriers were available. But we did have the Intel, Admiral King was a very aggressive guy, and with carrier strength equalized by Midway, Nimitz could afford greater risks.
Point of order: the Battle of Midway was not part of a US "offensive," the Japanese attacked Midway and the US fended them off. It was a major victory, but technically not an offensive, I think.
I was talking to the Trilateral Commission just the other day, and their parting words baffled me. Until now.
"Tell Dok we said, 'Hi.'"
FDR was a socialist surrounded by communists who went to Europe to save Marxism? I would love to hear Robinson define "socialist," "communist," and "Marxism." Hell, for that matter, I'd like to see him point out Europe on a globe.
I'd like to see him define "FDR."
he will be glad to define "socialist," "communist," and "Marxism" for you . . . as soon as he's done working out what "woke" means.
Ta, Dok. Yes, I am weird. I am not, however, nuts. Robinson is nuts.
"Weirdly nuts," if that's not already a Roald Dahl character.
"Weyrdly Nuttz" sounds more Dickensian to me...
That’s good!
Not exactly a conspiracy but merely a theory: the US invested much, much more in the war in Europe because Europeans are "white" people, and most in the Pacific are not. Heck,, if you notice, in movies about the civilians in the Pacific War, they center on imperialist planters or missionaries or other colonial types, not on the colonized.
Occam's razor says we had long-time allies and therefore bases in Europe close to Germany and the Pacific is big and more complicated geographically. Your theory (not in the scientific sense) may have had some influence, though.
What bases did the US have in Europe prior to the Second World War? Or anywhere outside the US (other than Guantanamo) at the time?
I am referring to the use of Britain, which we had been supplying with materiel for years, as a base. It's right there, vis-a-vis Nazi Germany.
Or maybe because most Americans had more in common with Europe than your average Long Hut dweller of Papua New Guinea.
Closer, too. The Pacific is pretty big.
"Closer, too. The Pacific is pretty big."
Ding ding ding
Well, yes, you can put it that way... Europe being more "like us" in general, though to say that the assumption that western Europe was what defined "civilization" didn't factor into US policy would be absurd. The US was quite willing to support Fascists in, say, "kinda European" Latin America (Brazil was both a fascist country, and a member of the Allies) as long as they kept their place in the "world order" of the time.
This baloney about FDR knowing that Japan was going to attack Pearl Harbor and letting it happen so he could justify declaring war is a VERY OLD CONSPIRACY THEORY. I studied this in my International Relations courses in college in the mid 70's, and it wasn't a new idea even then.
My wife and I recently sought out Teapot Rock. It's still there!
"And this drawing shows the Pilgrims' submarine surfacing near Plymouth Rock as the deck gunner takes out a gathering of curious Wampanoag tribal elders."
<<Did it get stupider? Of course it did.>>
The Andy Letter!
https://www.cartalk.com/radio/letter/andy-letter
That's great!
I want to know if Jamie in Ojai California was a Bionic Woman reference, and if so, the The Car Guys get it?
I'll bet Robinson has convincing stuff to share, about the cigarette-smoking guy on the grassy knoll.
Triple Overpass and/or Howard Hunt speculation is probably beyond Mark's ken.
FFS NC
They had a bet with South C. on who could nominate the most Batshit MAGAT.
They won
To Mark "CrazyMotherFucker" Robinson on his statement that even though Japan attacked the US at Pearl Harbor, but most of the effort went to the war in Europe, the thousands of men who fought and died in the Pacific, their families and loved ones, would love to have a word. Another cowardly idiot.
Please explain to me fellow wonketeers: Does this blithering idiot stand a chance in hell of being elected governor of NC? Is NC more stupid than SC?
Yes
Debatable
See: Alabama
A chance I guess if NC Democrats don't hammer him all day every day.
Coral Sea was purely defensive, but Midway not so much. Code breaks led the United States to know what was afoot and Nimitz dispatched his three carriers not to defend Midway per se,, but specifically to ambush the Japanese carriers. Successful performance of that ambush did result in Japan calling off the invasion of Midway, but Nimitz had also specifically given his admirals permission to call off the attack and let Midway fend for itself if they felt there was no opportunity to inflict greater damage upon the Japanese than they themselves would suffer. The Japanese carriers were the target of a defensive-offensive operation, with Midway itself ultimately expendable if it came to that.
I love these stupid no shit NYT headlines
“Israel and Hamas Signal Openness to Cease-Fire Plan, but Stop Short of Accepting It”
Yes because if they accepted it they would have already accepted it.
Dok, hate to contradict you, but Coral Sea and Midway were defensive operations, to stop Japanese seaborne invasions of Port Moresby and Midway Island, respectively. Nimitz even used the phrase "fleet opposed invasion" in his orders. Operation Watchtower, the invasion of Guadalcanal in August 1942 was the first American offensive. Almost exactly one month later, Operation Torch, the landings on Vichy French colonial holdings in North Africa in support of the North African campaign was the first operation against Germany and it's allies.
Ironically, in another timeline, Torch probably would have happened first. Guadalcanal was a rush job, thrown together when intelligence discovered that Japan was moving to establish strong bases in the southern Solomons, with the intention of cutting Australia off from the U.S. If we had discovered that later, a larger and more fully prepared counteroffensive would have been required, which would have taken longer to put together. It might have had to wait until the first couple of Essex Class carriers were available. But we did have the Intel, Admiral King was a very aggressive guy, and with carrier strength equalized by Midway, Nimitz could afford greater risks.