Mike Rinder was good people. I never met him personally after his escape, but here he is, presumably during the filing of "Scientology and Me." John Sweeny with his back to us, Mike Rinder centre facing us.
Ugh, good for him. I have been reading a bit in Christian apologetics and their standard line about Scientology is that the state can't regulate it because even a totally fake religion is shielded under the sacred doctrine of Freedom of Religion. Where would we be if the state could say what was a religion and what wasn't, they wail. Well, I can answer that. Much further along in investigating and holding responsible a mass of sexual abusers and financial frauds, that's where we would be.
Freedom of religion isn't necessary unless you want to imply that religious thought is superior to other kinds of thought. Freedom of thought, freedom of speech, and freedom of legal association would cover all that a church might want to do legitimately.
Scientology is abhorrent! My childhood friend became involved as an adult married another Scientologist adtheir children are fully indoctrinated. She is my best friend's sister. The children were separated from their parents for years as kids going to specialized schools (Sea-Org).
One of them was my high school girlfriend. Her hair had been long, like Joan Baez, so it was shocking to see her on the front page of the Chronicle, shorn like the others.
Thank you for your remembrance of Mike Rinder. I was never so grateful that both he and Leah Remini got out of Scientology because they took on the weight of getting everyone to recognize how awful Scientology is. /former Old Guard never Scientology protester. Bon voyage, Mike!
Actually CoS is a far worse than many other denominations, although I would never call CoS a "church", given that amassing a huge fortune for the people at the top is their sole purpose.
And the “amassing a fortune for those at top” is different from any other church how?
Sarcasm I admit; clearly I KNOW there are some (a few? a tiny fraction of the total?) churches run by and for the benefit of the parishioners. But institutionally “church” is a way to tell people that they are evil, and the only way they will be good and saved is to give money/authority/power to the church leaders. Who will dole it out (or keep) as they see fit.
"Church of Scientology proudly celebrated “a year of explosive growth,” a claim that sounds utterly delusional given that it’s hard to imagine too many people are lining up to join them these days"
Given its popularity these days, the CoS might consider 1% increase as "explosive growth."
“Based on the attrition since that time [2010], and data from those who have left since then, I’d say 20,000 was more accurate now,” [Jeff Hawkins] said.
"Over 32 million visitors have viewed more than 70 million videos in 17 languages on the Scientology website in the last 12 months." op cit
Question: How many of those "[o]ver 32 million visitors" were unique and not return viewers? I would imagine that Scientology cultists have visited myriad times, and that many of the unique viewers went to the site out of curiosity rather than a sincere interest in joining the CoS.
-----
"Rinder said his primary job was to "intimidate, defame, harass, discredit, and effectively silence any criticism of Scientology" as part of the “fair game” policy they have repeatedly claimed is no longer a thing"
This is a TIL moment for me. It's been obvious for a long time now that Mooseballs Mussolini's claims of being a Christian rang hollow, but I never knew he was a Scientologist and part of the Church's Office of Special Affairs; and a long-standing member at that. The Fulvous Flatulence has been using the fair game policy in his business dealings from his earliest days.
I just looked up whether Trump has ties to the CoS. I think your assertion that he's a Scientologist is doubtful. Can you add some links to articles that support your statement?
That said, it wouldn't surprise me if he cozied up to them with false promises so they'd give money to his campaigns.
Sorry, "I never knew he was a Scientologist and part of the Church's Office of Special Affairs" was said with tongue firmly in cheek. It was a riff on how OSA worked, which is/was extremely similar to how the Fulvous Flatulence conducts his business and his adult(?) life.
I spent my career in construction marketing, and had too many friends and clients fall to Mooseballs Mussolini's business practices of "intimidate, defame, harass, discredit, and effectively silence any criticism of [himself]."
He perfected his technique of using lawfare 40 years ago when he would tell a contractor that if they wanted the balance of monies still owed *under contract* to take him to court to get it. If a suit was filed he appealed over and over again, until his creditor either gave up because what he owed them approached what their lawyers charged, or in some cases, actually had to close their doors and lay-off all of their employees because of the Amber Ardipithecus ramidus' actions. If any contractor derogatorily said word number one about being ripped off, the Mango Malignancy would "flex his muscles" to defame and intimidate them. Next, he would try to discredit them claiming they did shoddy work or overcharged for their services. If that didn't work, he'd sue for defamation of character.
Bottom line? The Pumpkin Pestilence is, was, and always will be a shitstain in the country's underwear.
Oof. Are you feeling better? That shit (no pun intended) is EVERYWHERE. My husband has been invited to join some former work colleagues for a few beers in London on Friday, but is considering noping out—as he said, "With all the crowded trains I'd have to take to get there, I'd probably end up exploding from both ends for a week afterwards. No, thanks."
"Because of this, and the work of others, people all over will be less prone to fall for their bullshit, less likely to be abused and less likely to be drained of all their money and alienated from their family members."
I'd like to believe that, but I look at what is happening today and I'm not sure I believe that people will be any wiser even when they're armed with all of the information showing what a bullshit, abusive con it is.
It’s hard to recruit people to a cult if they know in advance that it’s an abusive cult. Once they’re in, though, they will endure a lot of abuse before they finally pull themselves out of it.
Most of those are just republicans like Glitch McConnell who are going with party in order to hold onto power. They know Trump is unfit for office, but they see that supporting him is the only way to have influence now.
Personal story about Scientology. I once dated a young woman who was an aspiring artist, a happy, free-wheeling soul. She drove an MGB sports car, and she was a real beauty. She looked like Carly Simon complete with that smile and dimples, she was that beautiful. We had chemistry to burn, and we got on really well. She could have been the love of my life except... she was into Scientology. She dragged me to a Dianetics center for a "personality test", which of course revealed that I had serious problems that only Scientology could solve. To say I was not impressed would be an understatement.
She and I argued about it afterwards. My big concern at the time was the intense hard sell I was subjected to. I may have been a shy naive barely-old-enough-to-shave farmboy from the Midwest back then, but I understood that hard sells like that are red flags that things are not on the up-and-up.
But she was determined to cross that "Bridge to Total Freedom", and if I wasn't on board, I would be hindering her. So, we went our separate ways. I heard later that she quit her job and sold her sports car to finance her dream. I think of her from time to time. I hope she didn't wind up in the Sea Org.
Any religion is nothing more than a control mechanism - stay clear (pun intended).
Mike Rinder was good people. I never met him personally after his escape, but here he is, presumably during the filing of "Scientology and Me." John Sweeny with his back to us, Mike Rinder centre facing us.
https://www.tingleff.org/jensting/duke_tour/images/London0703/London_070331_05_l.jpg
Ugh, good for him. I have been reading a bit in Christian apologetics and their standard line about Scientology is that the state can't regulate it because even a totally fake religion is shielded under the sacred doctrine of Freedom of Religion. Where would we be if the state could say what was a religion and what wasn't, they wail. Well, I can answer that. Much further along in investigating and holding responsible a mass of sexual abusers and financial frauds, that's where we would be.
Freedom of religion isn't necessary unless you want to imply that religious thought is superior to other kinds of thought. Freedom of thought, freedom of speech, and freedom of legal association would cover all that a church might want to do legitimately.
We still haven't found Shelly, have we?
Scientology is abhorrent! My childhood friend became involved as an adult married another Scientologist adtheir children are fully indoctrinated. She is my best friend's sister. The children were separated from their parents for years as kids going to specialized schools (Sea-Org).
We can haz taxes on all the churches?
One of them was my high school girlfriend. Her hair had been long, like Joan Baez, so it was shocking to see her on the front page of the Chronicle, shorn like the others.
Wow. Talk about using your last words for positive effect!
Ta, Robyn.
Thank you for your remembrance of Mike Rinder. I was never so grateful that both he and Leah Remini got out of Scientology because they took on the weight of getting everyone to recognize how awful Scientology is. /former Old Guard never Scientology protester. Bon voyage, Mike!
𝑤𝑎𝑣𝑒𝑠 𝑡𝑜 𝐷𝑒𝑎𝑛𝑎
Scientology: just like any other church, but more obvious about it.
Actually CoS is a far worse than many other denominations, although I would never call CoS a "church", given that amassing a huge fortune for the people at the top is their sole purpose.
And the “amassing a fortune for those at top” is different from any other church how?
Sarcasm I admit; clearly I KNOW there are some (a few? a tiny fraction of the total?) churches run by and for the benefit of the parishioners. But institutionally “church” is a way to tell people that they are evil, and the only way they will be good and saved is to give money/authority/power to the church leaders. Who will dole it out (or keep) as they see fit.
I agree that's absolutely the case with the megachurches, but I do tend to trust the Unitarians and Quakers.
"Church of Scientology proudly celebrated “a year of explosive growth,” a claim that sounds utterly delusional given that it’s hard to imagine too many people are lining up to join them these days"
Given its popularity these days, the CoS might consider 1% increase as "explosive growth."
"Over 11,000 Scientology Churches, Missions and affiliated groups exist across 167 nations, four times in just ten years." https://www.scientologynews.org/quick-facts/
-and yet-
“Based on the attrition since that time [2010], and data from those who have left since then, I’d say 20,000 was more accurate now,” [Jeff Hawkins] said.
Rinder has reached the same conclusion, citing 20,000 active members, in a January 2016 post." https://www.reddit.com/r/scientology/comments/97axrs/how_many_scientologists_are_there_in_the_world/?rdt=38923
-and-
"Scientology is well-known for its exaggeration of statistics, for example publicly claiming six million members when internal membership reports show only 40,000" https://medium.com/how-many-scientologists-are-there-really/counting-scientology-6-ias-membership-d98f40fab497 [2018, and they might even be lying to themselves with that 40K number.]
-----
"Over 32 million visitors have viewed more than 70 million videos in 17 languages on the Scientology website in the last 12 months." op cit
Question: How many of those "[o]ver 32 million visitors" were unique and not return viewers? I would imagine that Scientology cultists have visited myriad times, and that many of the unique viewers went to the site out of curiosity rather than a sincere interest in joining the CoS.
-----
"Rinder said his primary job was to "intimidate, defame, harass, discredit, and effectively silence any criticism of Scientology" as part of the “fair game” policy they have repeatedly claimed is no longer a thing"
This is a TIL moment for me. It's been obvious for a long time now that Mooseballs Mussolini's claims of being a Christian rang hollow, but I never knew he was a Scientologist and part of the Church's Office of Special Affairs; and a long-standing member at that. The Fulvous Flatulence has been using the fair game policy in his business dealings from his earliest days.
fnord
I just looked up whether Trump has ties to the CoS. I think your assertion that he's a Scientologist is doubtful. Can you add some links to articles that support your statement?
That said, it wouldn't surprise me if he cozied up to them with false promises so they'd give money to his campaigns.
Sorry, "I never knew he was a Scientologist and part of the Church's Office of Special Affairs" was said with tongue firmly in cheek. It was a riff on how OSA worked, which is/was extremely similar to how the Fulvous Flatulence conducts his business and his adult(?) life.
I spent my career in construction marketing, and had too many friends and clients fall to Mooseballs Mussolini's business practices of "intimidate, defame, harass, discredit, and effectively silence any criticism of [himself]."
He perfected his technique of using lawfare 40 years ago when he would tell a contractor that if they wanted the balance of monies still owed *under contract* to take him to court to get it. If a suit was filed he appealed over and over again, until his creditor either gave up because what he owed them approached what their lawyers charged, or in some cases, actually had to close their doors and lay-off all of their employees because of the Amber Ardipithecus ramidus' actions. If any contractor derogatorily said word number one about being ripped off, the Mango Malignancy would "flex his muscles" to defame and intimidate them. Next, he would try to discredit them claiming they did shoddy work or overcharged for their services. If that didn't work, he'd sue for defamation of character.
Bottom line? The Pumpkin Pestilence is, was, and always will be a shitstain in the country's underwear.
fnord
If you’re expecting 10% contraction, and you only have 5%, that COULD be spun as “explosive growth…”
I had norovirus last week. Let me tell you about “explosive growth”.
Oof. Are you feeling better? That shit (no pun intended) is EVERYWHERE. My husband has been invited to join some former work colleagues for a few beers in London on Friday, but is considering noping out—as he said, "With all the crowded trains I'd have to take to get there, I'd probably end up exploding from both ends for a week afterwards. No, thanks."
"Because of this, and the work of others, people all over will be less prone to fall for their bullshit, less likely to be abused and less likely to be drained of all their money and alienated from their family members."
I'd like to believe that, but I look at what is happening today and I'm not sure I believe that people will be any wiser even when they're armed with all of the information showing what a bullshit, abusive con it is.
It’s hard to recruit people to a cult if they know in advance that it’s an abusive cult. Once they’re in, though, they will endure a lot of abuse before they finally pull themselves out of it.
This is true of both Scientology and maga.
There's a lot of former Never tr*mpers in maga, though.
Most of those are just republicans like Glitch McConnell who are going with party in order to hold onto power. They know Trump is unfit for office, but they see that supporting him is the only way to have influence now.
Personal story about Scientology. I once dated a young woman who was an aspiring artist, a happy, free-wheeling soul. She drove an MGB sports car, and she was a real beauty. She looked like Carly Simon complete with that smile and dimples, she was that beautiful. We had chemistry to burn, and we got on really well. She could have been the love of my life except... she was into Scientology. She dragged me to a Dianetics center for a "personality test", which of course revealed that I had serious problems that only Scientology could solve. To say I was not impressed would be an understatement.
She and I argued about it afterwards. My big concern at the time was the intense hard sell I was subjected to. I may have been a shy naive barely-old-enough-to-shave farmboy from the Midwest back then, but I understood that hard sells like that are red flags that things are not on the up-and-up.
But she was determined to cross that "Bridge to Total Freedom", and if I wasn't on board, I would be hindering her. So, we went our separate ways. I heard later that she quit her job and sold her sports car to finance her dream. I think of her from time to time. I hope she didn't wind up in the Sea Org.
Is there a bigger red flag for a potential love interest than them being into Scientology?
Do these body thetans makes my ass look fat?