[“defund the police,” which we are never ever ever supposed to say, I guess.]
Correct, actually! I just want to know who let the FOX NEWS operative into the antifa meeting when the term 'defund the police' was coined. I can't believe that the same people who [should] know that the "ACA" polls better than "Obamacare" didn't take a minute or two to consider if 'Defund the Police' would play in Poughkeepsie—it does not.
i also can't believe it's been 5 fucking years since the rollout of Defund the Police, we know the policies ARE popular, the branding is NOT; but we still haven't come up with different branding.
The sunk-cost fallacy is not just a river in Egypt. Like try coming up with something that sounds vaguely pro-cop, pitch the policies as expanding police departments to have specialized units dealing with unhoused, mental illness, etc. Is that possible? huh? HUH??
[Maybe that particular phrase scares people]
It doesn't just 'scare' people, it actively disregards their personal experiences that cops are mostly normal ass people trying to do the best they can.
Bravo Robyn. I haven’t seen any media coverage of this topic in a very long time. As an old fart, I suspect that some of this positive change is because cell phone and body cam videos are displaying police brutality on social media. Millions of people can see with their own two eyes the ugly truth. Year after year, social media is showing how the police usually treat young African American boys as dangerous suspects and use excessive force without evidence. Another factor is the opioid epidemic among whites. Middle class white communities are finally getting a taste of what the African American communities went through during the crack epidemic. And, people are seeing how modern technology, like DNA evidence, is overturning convictions revealing the injustice of our judicial system.
I don't think Netflix has ever released any viewing numbers for it, but I'm sure the excellent 'Innocence Files' has opened many eyes since it first aired in 2020. Still has 100% on Rotten Tomatoes, and 86 (Universal Acclaim) on Metacritic.
I'm trying to think of the people who hurt me most in my life. If I had to settle on three? My dad, when he cheated on threw away thirty-five years of marriage for some new squeeze. My aunt's husband, when he shot her and then himself right in my mom's house. And Trump, when he... well.
Not foreign terrorists, not immigrants, not degenerate youth, not some other scary brown people. In many a sense, the call from the psycho was coming from inside the house.
You can say it, but it won't be as effective as you believe it might. Just as it is easy to say "Defund the police," it is just as easy to interpret it in a way we wouldn't like. MAGAt brother of mine insisted that it means "Hurt the police" or "Hate the police" by taking money from their salaries, retirement, widows and orphans funds, etc. In addition, funding programs to reduce the reasons behind many crimes is nowhere in that easy slogan, only in the minds of the people throwing it around. That's why I think it fails as a political slogan.
I am in favor of not buying surplus military weaponry for the non-federal constabulary in the USA. I am in favor of reining in the police unions because too many of them have allowed corruption to flourish amongst them. I am in favor of developing ways to detect fascist minds and criminal minds attempting to join the police and either preventing them from doing so, or yeeting them out if they commit crimes and atrocities while on the force. I am in favor of stiffer penalties for lying under oath or submitting false reports as an officer of the law. I am in favor of rewarding good cops, no matter how much they resemble fabled unicorns right now. I think cops who de-escalate and solve crimes in the best ways should be rewarded and studied and their techniques be incorporated into training cadets. I want bad incentives to be eliminated as much as possible, substituting better, good ones. Police work can be incredibly dangerous and they should be given salaries and perks to help them stay on the straight path, including teaching them techniques for handling stress and rage, recognizing depression, and so on. However, those same things should be taken away if a cop thinks he can have those and still act out/wild out against civilians. Rape, domestic violence, and sexual assaults by a cop should be reason to investigate, prosecute, pursue justice with fervor, and the penalties should be higher for them doing it than civilians. The badge should never be a shield for committing crimes. If serving in the military is supposed to be honorable and respected, so it should be for law enforcement. A police state is in no one's real interests, not even for the ones who want that power or hope to abuse it. The worst people are often in charge of prisons and the police.
We'd have to rebuild it from the ground up, with plenty of input and wiser heads prevailing. And where would the money come from? Those trillions of dollars are being hoovered up by crazy rich people and by corporations who only care about profit. I want people to prepare for an opportunity to make changes for good. Maybe roll it out through some test environments where politics and worthless scribblers don't get to ruin it. *Sigh* No, my name is not Pollyanna. I recognize that this is probably impossible.
MAGAts are going to interpret anything we say in the worst way possible. No matter what. As others have pointed out on this thread, meanwhile, we tried saying "Reform the Police." It didn't work.
I don’t think we’re going to reach MAGAts for a come-to-Jesus moment concerning the police. I do care about reaching the mushy middle and the low information voters. Unfortunately, “Defund the Police” got out well in front of any other slogans, and that’s the one too many remember.
Ta, Robyn. I have never supported the death penalty, and few things horrify me more than prison rape and other forms of sexual assault. Just Detention is a great charity if anyone has muneez left after feeding the Wonkette kitty.
Great piece. Apologies for choosing one topic to comment on but I must: I'm GenX, a lifelong independent who votes blue, and I have been opposed to capital punishment since I was a young person, beginning to grasp history and political science in middle school. To me, ceding power of life and death to the State was abhorrent (and it still is). I was born just at the end of Vietnam, not even thirty years after the end of WWII, and the horrors of authoritarianism around the globe were actively taught in my classrooms. Capital punishment HERE appalled me. It's what Mao and Stalin and Pol Pot and Hitler did. It's also connected to my lifelong pro-choice position. A nation that can kill us back can also compel women to terminate pregnancies a la China, and carrying a child by choice is the flip side of being able to terminate by choice, without the say so of "the State." I would love to hear this philosophical principle discussed widely, because it's so critically important as we fight for the right to choose our government.
The state fucks up way too often to legally have the power to kill any of us. Prosecuters lie and hide evidence all the time. For that reason alone I will never support the death penalty.
All the Crime! Crime! bullshit aside, it *does* seem like financial attacks have become ubiquitous. And I’m *sure* it’s spinning out of control, when you count all the “normal” business practices that should be illegal.
Yeah, that's white collar crime. You will never see those people get the same sentence has those who coordinate to steal TVs, for instance. There is probably a reason its called "white" collar. Am I right?
Yeah, but…White women doing white collar criming seem to bring out the Old Testament impulses in the prosecutors. Martha Stewart and Elizabeth Holmes spring to mind.
I think a big factor now is people are seeing ICE goons running roughshod over people’s rights and are thinking the supposed cure is worse than the disease.
“Defund the police” is still a terrible slogan precisely because you have to explain what you mean by it. This has been perennial problem for democrats and liberals who keep thinking that if you take the time to explain all the nuances of what you mean, people will come around to their point of view.
It doesn’t work that way. Republicans pounce on “Defund the police” and make it mean “leftists are going to shut down all the police departments and open up the prison doors!”
It doesn’t matter that it’s not true. All that matters is that they get people to believe it. Whatever else you can about republicans, they are really good at rhetoric that stimulates the lizard brains of people. They plow through nuance like JD plows through the sofa department.
Republicans are going to shout bad-faith interpretations of whatever we say no matter what. Tailoring messaging around that is wasted energy. Meanwhile, as others have said we tried "Reform the Police," "Police the Police," and they didn't work.
Are your saying Republicans are pushing a false narrative? I kid. They would lie about the contents of their lunch if it made a buck for a rich person.
[“defund the police,” which we are never ever ever supposed to say, I guess.]
Correct, actually! I just want to know who let the FOX NEWS operative into the antifa meeting when the term 'defund the police' was coined. I can't believe that the same people who [should] know that the "ACA" polls better than "Obamacare" didn't take a minute or two to consider if 'Defund the Police' would play in Poughkeepsie—it does not.
i also can't believe it's been 5 fucking years since the rollout of Defund the Police, we know the policies ARE popular, the branding is NOT; but we still haven't come up with different branding.
The sunk-cost fallacy is not just a river in Egypt. Like try coming up with something that sounds vaguely pro-cop, pitch the policies as expanding police departments to have specialized units dealing with unhoused, mental illness, etc. Is that possible? huh? HUH??
[Maybe that particular phrase scares people]
It doesn't just 'scare' people, it actively disregards their personal experiences that cops are mostly normal ass people trying to do the best they can.
Bravo Robyn. I haven’t seen any media coverage of this topic in a very long time. As an old fart, I suspect that some of this positive change is because cell phone and body cam videos are displaying police brutality on social media. Millions of people can see with their own two eyes the ugly truth. Year after year, social media is showing how the police usually treat young African American boys as dangerous suspects and use excessive force without evidence. Another factor is the opioid epidemic among whites. Middle class white communities are finally getting a taste of what the African American communities went through during the crack epidemic. And, people are seeing how modern technology, like DNA evidence, is overturning convictions revealing the injustice of our judicial system.
I don't think Netflix has ever released any viewing numbers for it, but I'm sure the excellent 'Innocence Files' has opened many eyes since it first aired in 2020. Still has 100% on Rotten Tomatoes, and 86 (Universal Acclaim) on Metacritic.
I'm trying to think of the people who hurt me most in my life. If I had to settle on three? My dad, when he cheated on threw away thirty-five years of marriage for some new squeeze. My aunt's husband, when he shot her and then himself right in my mom's house. And Trump, when he... well.
Not foreign terrorists, not immigrants, not degenerate youth, not some other scary brown people. In many a sense, the call from the psycho was coming from inside the house.
You can say it, but it won't be as effective as you believe it might. Just as it is easy to say "Defund the police," it is just as easy to interpret it in a way we wouldn't like. MAGAt brother of mine insisted that it means "Hurt the police" or "Hate the police" by taking money from their salaries, retirement, widows and orphans funds, etc. In addition, funding programs to reduce the reasons behind many crimes is nowhere in that easy slogan, only in the minds of the people throwing it around. That's why I think it fails as a political slogan.
I am in favor of not buying surplus military weaponry for the non-federal constabulary in the USA. I am in favor of reining in the police unions because too many of them have allowed corruption to flourish amongst them. I am in favor of developing ways to detect fascist minds and criminal minds attempting to join the police and either preventing them from doing so, or yeeting them out if they commit crimes and atrocities while on the force. I am in favor of stiffer penalties for lying under oath or submitting false reports as an officer of the law. I am in favor of rewarding good cops, no matter how much they resemble fabled unicorns right now. I think cops who de-escalate and solve crimes in the best ways should be rewarded and studied and their techniques be incorporated into training cadets. I want bad incentives to be eliminated as much as possible, substituting better, good ones. Police work can be incredibly dangerous and they should be given salaries and perks to help them stay on the straight path, including teaching them techniques for handling stress and rage, recognizing depression, and so on. However, those same things should be taken away if a cop thinks he can have those and still act out/wild out against civilians. Rape, domestic violence, and sexual assaults by a cop should be reason to investigate, prosecute, pursue justice with fervor, and the penalties should be higher for them doing it than civilians. The badge should never be a shield for committing crimes. If serving in the military is supposed to be honorable and respected, so it should be for law enforcement. A police state is in no one's real interests, not even for the ones who want that power or hope to abuse it. The worst people are often in charge of prisons and the police.
We'd have to rebuild it from the ground up, with plenty of input and wiser heads prevailing. And where would the money come from? Those trillions of dollars are being hoovered up by crazy rich people and by corporations who only care about profit. I want people to prepare for an opportunity to make changes for good. Maybe roll it out through some test environments where politics and worthless scribblers don't get to ruin it. *Sigh* No, my name is not Pollyanna. I recognize that this is probably impossible.
MAGAts are going to interpret anything we say in the worst way possible. No matter what. As others have pointed out on this thread, meanwhile, we tried saying "Reform the Police." It didn't work.
I don’t think we’re going to reach MAGAts for a come-to-Jesus moment concerning the police. I do care about reaching the mushy middle and the low information voters. Unfortunately, “Defund the Police” got out well in front of any other slogans, and that’s the one too many remember.
"rather than cops who are not obligated to do anything about it until after the fact"
Technically, I'm pretty sure they're legally not obligated to do anything about it even after the fact.
Thank you for an excellent article.
Ta, Robyn. I have never supported the death penalty, and few things horrify me more than prison rape and other forms of sexual assault. Just Detention is a great charity if anyone has muneez left after feeding the Wonkette kitty.
I do not understand how anyone can be for the death penalty. I do not understand why we want to imprison juveniles. I do not understand.
Never underestimate the human desire for revenge.
We now have a President seemingly ready to deatroy the planet over one lost election...
Prison abolition columns are my favorite Robyn columns.
Great piece. Apologies for choosing one topic to comment on but I must: I'm GenX, a lifelong independent who votes blue, and I have been opposed to capital punishment since I was a young person, beginning to grasp history and political science in middle school. To me, ceding power of life and death to the State was abhorrent (and it still is). I was born just at the end of Vietnam, not even thirty years after the end of WWII, and the horrors of authoritarianism around the globe were actively taught in my classrooms. Capital punishment HERE appalled me. It's what Mao and Stalin and Pol Pot and Hitler did. It's also connected to my lifelong pro-choice position. A nation that can kill us back can also compel women to terminate pregnancies a la China, and carrying a child by choice is the flip side of being able to terminate by choice, without the say so of "the State." I would love to hear this philosophical principle discussed widely, because it's so critically important as we fight for the right to choose our government.
The state fucks up way too often to legally have the power to kill any of us. Prosecuters lie and hide evidence all the time. For that reason alone I will never support the death penalty.
All the Crime! Crime! bullshit aside, it *does* seem like financial attacks have become ubiquitous. And I’m *sure* it’s spinning out of control, when you count all the “normal” business practices that should be illegal.
Yeah, that's white collar crime. You will never see those people get the same sentence has those who coordinate to steal TVs, for instance. There is probably a reason its called "white" collar. Am I right?
Yeah, but…White women doing white collar criming seem to bring out the Old Testament impulses in the prosecutors. Martha Stewart and Elizabeth Holmes spring to mind.
I think a big factor now is people are seeing ICE goons running roughshod over people’s rights and are thinking the supposed cure is worse than the disease.
You really can't see the ICE footage and believe they're out there protecting the public from lawlessness.
Maybe the death penalty for the thug army? Takes care of crime and stormtroopers simultaneously!
“Defund the police” is still a terrible slogan precisely because you have to explain what you mean by it. This has been perennial problem for democrats and liberals who keep thinking that if you take the time to explain all the nuances of what you mean, people will come around to their point of view.
It doesn’t work that way. Republicans pounce on “Defund the police” and make it mean “leftists are going to shut down all the police departments and open up the prison doors!”
It doesn’t matter that it’s not true. All that matters is that they get people to believe it. Whatever else you can about republicans, they are really good at rhetoric that stimulates the lizard brains of people. They plow through nuance like JD plows through the sofa department.
Republicans are going to shout bad-faith interpretations of whatever we say no matter what. Tailoring messaging around that is wasted energy. Meanwhile, as others have said we tried "Reform the Police," "Police the Police," and they didn't work.
"Fuck the Police" has a nice ring to it though.
True, but “Defund the Police” obviously didn’t work either, so why keep wasting energy on it?
Maybe de-funding the Republican reptiles is a worthy goal? Stop paying taxes when possible and also a General Strike?
We have to keep it simple. Even when the subject is not simple. I wish that wasn't true, but it is.
If you're explaining, you're losing
Are your saying Republicans are pushing a false narrative? I kid. They would lie about the contents of their lunch if it made a buck for a rich person.