What struck me reading the majority opinion and liberals' concurrence was how bloodless they both are. These are kids who face great harm. Only Justice Jackson's dissent really acknowledges that.
IANAL, but is it possible that Kagan and Sotomayor here saw a way to also protect GAC providers going forward? A number of states have either passed or teed up legislation that would make it illegal to even tell a minor there's such a thing as a trans identity, gender dysphoria, or refer them for GAC, even if it's what the parents also want.
I know this will piss off some people,. but I see what might be the reasoning of the (relative) centrists among the 8 who voted for this. If a "gag order" statute on conversion therapy speech is upheld, how will the Four Wise Souls among the six Rs who voted for this be able to affirm a "gag order" statute on talking with a patient about abortion? (I count not Sam the Sham or Uncle Thomas among the Wise, because THEY will contort some distinction.)
This is not simply speech. This is speech in a medical context. This is a doctor carrying out their job.
If your doctor told you to start doing heroin, you could have them turned in for violating their oath. Their responsilibities.
If your doctor told you, "Oh yes, drink until you vomit, nothing else will do," same thing - you should turn them in.
These types of doctors should lose their licenses.
These doctors are not ust having random conversations. They're dispensing medical advice, and they still have to take the Hippocratic Oath, which says "First, do no harm." Patients will take their advice more seriously, and that's why they have to watch out more than the guy who works at the auto shop.
Weird how none of the hundreds of books I’ve read featuring heterosexual couples have turned me straight. Even being in a happily married, monogamous, hetero-presenting relationship hasn’t turned me straight. Still find people of any gender, or no gender, attractive. Nothing will change that.
I’m gonna go out on a limb here and guess that if I started a clinic to convince straight people to become gay the decision would be different. Just saying.
OT-I pulled into a parking lot to check my phone—waiting on a call. This is just off the street where there are lots of strip malls and grocery stores and stuff.
There’s a giant building that used to be a K-Mart that’s now all covered and no signs.
I pulled along side which was all spaces but empty, and figured the cars in front were overflow from the grocery on the other side.
Within seconds of my getting out a guy all in black with ball cap and vest comes out a side door and shouts “ma’am! You can NOT stop here!” And I said oh, okay—I’m just checking my…
And he yells “this is federal property!”
At the same time, a guy dressed the same way comes out the front and started coming towards me so I jumped in and drove off. But there’s nothing indicating it’s anything let alone federal property.
I’m wondering if I discovered an ICE office? You know when you’re on federal property, and there would be a sign or something.
Once upon a youthful adventure we rented this campsite way out in BFE. We got a late start. The sun was preparing to set. We got lost.
Stop, check the map, check whatever passed for GPS back then. Have a bit of Schnapps.
Drive and drive and drive around some more, still lost. The sun was setting.
Stop, check the map, check whatever passed for GPS back then. Have a bit more Schnapps.
Drive and drive and drive around some more, still lost. The sun has set, and the light was failing.
Stop, check the map. Bit more Schnapps.
Eventually, in the burgeoning darkness, we located what we were pretty sure was our campsite. We set up camp and proceeded to polish off the Schnapps. It was a good time.
Until suddenly: Flashlights! Cops!
They had come to ask us why we had chosen to set up a tent in the driveway of a state prison.
Oh God, that reminds me of seeing some camouflaged guys pulling a beat up truck over. I thought it was real weird and it was in a church parking lot away from the traffic.
That's what I told my daughter a few weeks back. "We need to lay siege to the White House."
She was like, "Like the January 6 people did?"
Me: "Well....no. But we're right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" XD XD XD XD
ETA: It will take something like that or a world war to extract him if he gets dug in far enough. History shows that in very few cases have fascist regimes been overturned w/o that. :(
His entire ethos is “try and stop me.” And I’m sure he’s feeling butthurt that the Supremes said “LOL, GTFO” to his birthright citizenship nonsense yesterday.
And every single person stretching in a long line back to his childhood who has NOT tried to stop him is complicit in creating and unleashing the current ravenous and rapacious BEAST we now have on our hands.
It's odd because they could literally just keep him in a padded room decorated like the White House playing AI slop to him for a distraction. We'd all be better off
Nope she will never turn on him unless threatened with jail time. That won't happen with TFM and his pardons. The next one will be worse than her and may actually destroy any documents left.
Maybe shock therapy will be RE-introduced at BYU, where, when the current prophet of the Mormon church was running BYU they engaged in shock conversion therapy. Literally torture.
He also notes that licensed therapists who engage in such practices can still be disciplined by their licensing organizations (just like lawyers can be disbarred for advising clients to commit crimes), and they can also be subject to malpractice suits.
"He also notes that licensed therapists who engage in such practices can still be disciplined by their licensing organizations (just like lawyers can be disbarred for advising clients to commit crimes), and they can also be subject to malpractice suits."
Yes, but only AFTER they've hurt a shitload of kids. And while you're going after this bunch, there will be a new crop of "therapists" popping up to take their place. It will continue despite the fact that we KNOW what they are doing is harmful to kids. And if the behavior is forever protected by the Constitution, there's nothing lawmakers can ever do about it.
I am not a lawyer, but I can also think of some arguments to back the idea that this regulation is still needed despite that. So I would assume real lawyers are already writing briefs to that effect for when this goes back to the lower court.
Wingers always claim the Left is suppressing their Freeze Peach. By which they mean, they want to be free to disseminate every hateful, harmful, ignorant thing that floats around their heads. But it does not go both ways: you shouldn't get to have a Pride festival, for example, or be a drag queen in public, or be visible as a trans person.
What struck me reading the majority opinion and liberals' concurrence was how bloodless they both are. These are kids who face great harm. Only Justice Jackson's dissent really acknowledges that.
SCOTUS: Making torture great again.
IANAL, but is it possible that Kagan and Sotomayor here saw a way to also protect GAC providers going forward? A number of states have either passed or teed up legislation that would make it illegal to even tell a minor there's such a thing as a trans identity, gender dysphoria, or refer them for GAC, even if it's what the parents also want.
I know this will piss off some people,. but I see what might be the reasoning of the (relative) centrists among the 8 who voted for this. If a "gag order" statute on conversion therapy speech is upheld, how will the Four Wise Souls among the six Rs who voted for this be able to affirm a "gag order" statute on talking with a patient about abortion? (I count not Sam the Sham or Uncle Thomas among the Wise, because THEY will contort some distinction.)
This is not simply speech. This is speech in a medical context. This is a doctor carrying out their job.
If your doctor told you to start doing heroin, you could have them turned in for violating their oath. Their responsilibities.
If your doctor told you, "Oh yes, drink until you vomit, nothing else will do," same thing - you should turn them in.
These types of doctors should lose their licenses.
These doctors are not ust having random conversations. They're dispensing medical advice, and they still have to take the Hippocratic Oath, which says "First, do no harm." Patients will take their advice more seriously, and that's why they have to watch out more than the guy who works at the auto shop.
I'm with Justice Brown-Jackson.
Weird how none of the hundreds of books I’ve read featuring heterosexual couples have turned me straight. Even being in a happily married, monogamous, hetero-presenting relationship hasn’t turned me straight. Still find people of any gender, or no gender, attractive. Nothing will change that.
WELLLLL you just haven't read the right BOOKS , particularly the right five verses of the BUY-BULLLLLLLLL!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣😊
Since Sotomayor and Kagan voted for this, I have to believe there must be something technical about the case that we’re not seeing.
In her opinion, Kagan said something about free speech allowing for both sides of a discussion. To which I say, balderdash!
Both sides of every discussion are not equal, they do not deserve equal protection under the law.
It was framed as speech.
I’m gonna go out on a limb here and guess that if I started a clinic to convince straight people to become gay the decision would be different. Just saying.
Please put a glam room and a mimosa bar in the front reception area
Thank you for your attention to this matter
OT-I pulled into a parking lot to check my phone—waiting on a call. This is just off the street where there are lots of strip malls and grocery stores and stuff.
There’s a giant building that used to be a K-Mart that’s now all covered and no signs.
I pulled along side which was all spaces but empty, and figured the cars in front were overflow from the grocery on the other side.
Within seconds of my getting out a guy all in black with ball cap and vest comes out a side door and shouts “ma’am! You can NOT stop here!” And I said oh, okay—I’m just checking my…
And he yells “this is federal property!”
At the same time, a guy dressed the same way comes out the front and started coming towards me so I jumped in and drove off. But there’s nothing indicating it’s anything let alone federal property.
I’m wondering if I discovered an ICE office? You know when you’re on federal property, and there would be a sign or something.
Felt a little freaked out.
"Federal property? Well, the People own it then. Stand back." [I do not recommend trying this in person.]
I'm glad you're ok, Babe. Those were ICEthugs for sure.
Once upon a youthful adventure we rented this campsite way out in BFE. We got a late start. The sun was preparing to set. We got lost.
Stop, check the map, check whatever passed for GPS back then. Have a bit of Schnapps.
Drive and drive and drive around some more, still lost. The sun was setting.
Stop, check the map, check whatever passed for GPS back then. Have a bit more Schnapps.
Drive and drive and drive around some more, still lost. The sun has set, and the light was failing.
Stop, check the map. Bit more Schnapps.
Eventually, in the burgeoning darkness, we located what we were pretty sure was our campsite. We set up camp and proceeded to polish off the Schnapps. It was a good time.
Until suddenly: Flashlights! Cops!
They had come to ask us why we had chosen to set up a tent in the driveway of a state prison.
Answer: "Schnapps!"
Address?
Oh God, that reminds me of seeing some camouflaged guys pulling a beat up truck over. I thought it was real weird and it was in a church parking lot away from the traffic.
I immediately thought ICE
I don't blame you one bit, Babe.
And the details of that property need to be investigated.
Jade Helm!!!
You either stumbled into an ICE facility or one really big criminal thing going on in a rented building.
You definitely should talk with some immigration advocacy/anti-ICE group in your area about this.
Ummmm, ICE facilities ARE one really big fascist Nazi criminal thing going on in rented buildings. Period.
It’s in the same area with a discount grocery that appears to get a lot of immigrants and Mexican shops and two blocks from the court.
The court was where I was going to go if I got followed.
What in the Hell?
"A therapist and fundamentalist Christian..." What could possibly go wrong?
So now that vile beast is going to sign an EO to pay DHS, circumventing Congress.
Is this even legal?
Why do I ask anymore. It doens't matter. No one is going to stop that rabid beast.
We the People need to pay the Depraved Despot a visit and summarily evict the convicted criminal from OUR house.
I am deathly serious about this. He needs to GO and we need to be the ones who make it happen, dammit.
30,000 anti-government protesters killed is a conservative estimate about Iran this year. Trump would love to top that number.
That's what I told my daughter a few weeks back. "We need to lay siege to the White House."
She was like, "Like the January 6 people did?"
Me: "Well....no. But we're right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" XD XD XD XD
ETA: It will take something like that or a world war to extract him if he gets dug in far enough. History shows that in very few cases have fascist regimes been overturned w/o that. :(
We're not motivated to hang people.
Well, most of us...
We're the "nice" ones. But my fucking GOD, this is our COUNTRY and people are dying. :(
His entire ethos is “try and stop me.” And I’m sure he’s feeling butthurt that the Supremes said “LOL, GTFO” to his birthright citizenship nonsense yesterday.
And every single person stretching in a long line back to his childhood who has NOT tried to stop him is complicit in creating and unleashing the current ravenous and rapacious BEAST we now have on our hands.
It's odd because they could literally just keep him in a padded room decorated like the White House playing AI slop to him for a distraction. We'd all be better off
SCOTUS— hmmm, the US is clear, but SCOT is surely an acronym for some painful unwanted sex act.
"He got off, SCOT-free."
Rumor has it Bondi is on her way out. tick tock. The comments are stellar.
https://xcancel.com/ShelbyTalcott/status/2039710898621669569?s=20
Maybe TACO will hire someone competent.
HAHAHAHAHA-HAHAHAHAHAHA...haha *snickers*
Some times Baconz makes himself laugh
Lee Zeldin is the rumored replacement.
Lee Zeldin? I watched them open for Operation IV at the CBGBs once.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rAM1MKi7bNU
If she knows that she'll soon be lead to the nearest exit, she should release ALL of the Epstein files. Doubtful, but a man can dream.
Nope she will never turn on him unless threatened with jail time. That won't happen with TFM and his pardons. The next one will be worse than her and may actually destroy any documents left.
Right? I wonder if the 2nd wave is there to destroy evidence
Maybe shock therapy will be RE-introduced at BYU, where, when the current prophet of the Mormon church was running BYU they engaged in shock conversion therapy. Literally torture.
Clockwork Orange was not intended as training material
Magic underwear takes on a whole new meaning ...
“Then, we attach these wires to your scrotum like this, see, and… Voila! You’re straight.”
Vox's in-house SCOTUS watcher Ian Millhiser explains why the ruling was correct:
𝘈𝘴 𝘎𝘰𝘳𝘴𝘶𝘤𝘩 𝘸𝘳𝘪𝘵𝘦𝘴, 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘭𝘢𝘸 𝘵𝘳𝘦𝘢𝘵𝘴 𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘳𝘢𝘱𝘪𝘴𝘵𝘴 𝘥𝘪𝘧𝘧𝘦𝘳𝘦𝘯𝘵𝘭𝘺 𝘥𝘦𝘱𝘦𝘯𝘥𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘰𝘯 𝘸𝘩𝘪𝘤𝘩 𝘷𝘪𝘦𝘸𝘴 𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘺 𝘦𝘹𝘱𝘳𝘦𝘴𝘴 𝘢𝘣𝘰𝘶𝘵 𝘢 𝘤𝘭𝘪𝘦𝘯𝘵’𝘴 𝘴𝘦𝘹𝘶𝘢𝘭𝘪𝘵𝘺 𝘰𝘳 𝘨𝘦𝘯𝘥𝘦𝘳. “𝘞𝘪𝘵𝘩 𝘳𝘦𝘴𝘱𝘦𝘤𝘵 𝘵𝘰 𝘴𝘦𝘹𝘶𝘢𝘭 𝘰𝘳𝘪𝘦𝘯𝘵𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯,” 𝘧𝘰𝘳 𝘦𝘹𝘢𝘮𝘱𝘭𝘦,” 𝘊𝘰𝘭𝘰𝘳𝘢𝘥𝘰 𝘱𝘦𝘳𝘮𝘪𝘵𝘴 𝘢 𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘳𝘢𝘱𝘪𝘴𝘵 𝘵𝘰 “𝘢𝘧𝘧𝘪𝘳𝘮 𝘢 𝘤𝘭𝘪𝘦𝘯𝘵’𝘴 𝘴𝘦𝘹𝘶𝘢𝘭 𝘰𝘳𝘪𝘦𝘯𝘵𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯, 𝘣𝘶𝘵 𝘱𝘳𝘰𝘩𝘪𝘣𝘪𝘵𝘴 𝘩𝘦𝘳 𝘧𝘳𝘰𝘮 𝘴𝘱𝘦𝘢𝘬𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘪𝘯 𝘢𝘯𝘺 𝘸𝘢𝘺 𝘵𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘩𝘦𝘭𝘱𝘴 𝘢 𝘤𝘭𝘪𝘦𝘯𝘵 ‘𝘤𝘩𝘢𝘯𝘨𝘦’ 𝘩𝘪𝘴 𝘴𝘦𝘹𝘶𝘢𝘭 𝘢𝘵𝘵𝘳𝘢𝘤𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯𝘴 𝘰𝘳 𝘣𝘦𝘩𝘢𝘷𝘪𝘰𝘳𝘴.”
𝘋𝘪𝘴𝘤𝘳𝘪𝘮𝘪𝘯𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘣𝘢𝘴𝘦𝘥 𝘰𝘯 𝘷𝘪𝘦𝘸𝘱𝘰𝘪𝘯𝘵 𝘪𝘴 𝘫𝘶𝘴𝘵 𝘢𝘣𝘰𝘶𝘵 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘸𝘰𝘳𝘴𝘵 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘵𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘢 𝘴𝘵𝘢𝘵𝘦 𝘭𝘦𝘨𝘪𝘴𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘶𝘳𝘦 𝘤𝘢𝘯 𝘥𝘰 𝘪𝘧 𝘪𝘵 𝘸𝘢𝘯𝘵𝘴 𝘢 𝘭𝘢𝘸 𝘵𝘰 𝘴𝘶𝘳𝘷𝘪𝘷𝘦 𝘢 𝘍𝘪𝘳𝘴𝘵 𝘈𝘮𝘦𝘯𝘥𝘮𝘦𝘯𝘵 𝘤𝘩𝘢𝘭𝘭𝘦𝘯𝘨𝘦, 𝘸𝘩𝘪𝘤𝘩 𝘦𝘹𝘱𝘭𝘢𝘪𝘯𝘴 𝘸𝘩𝘺 𝘵𝘸𝘰 𝘰𝘧 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘊𝘰𝘶𝘳𝘵’𝘴 𝘵𝘩𝘳𝘦𝘦 𝘋𝘦𝘮𝘰𝘤𝘳𝘢𝘵𝘴 𝘫𝘰𝘪𝘯𝘦𝘥 𝘎𝘰𝘳𝘴𝘶𝘤𝘩’𝘴 𝘰𝘱𝘪𝘯𝘪𝘰𝘯. 𝘐𝘯 𝘢 𝘴𝘦𝘱𝘢𝘳𝘢𝘵𝘦 𝘤𝘰𝘯𝘤𝘶𝘳𝘳𝘦𝘯𝘤𝘦, 𝘒𝘢𝘨𝘢𝘯 𝘦𝘹𝘱𝘭𝘢𝘪𝘯𝘴 𝘸𝘩𝘺 𝘴𝘩𝘦 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘚𝘰𝘵𝘰𝘮𝘢𝘺𝘰𝘳 𝘷𝘰𝘵𝘦𝘥 𝘢𝘨𝘢𝘪𝘯𝘴𝘵 𝘊𝘰𝘭𝘰𝘳𝘢𝘥𝘰’𝘴 𝘭𝘢𝘸, 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘩𝘦𝘳 𝘰𝘱𝘪𝘯𝘪𝘰𝘯 𝘭𝘦𝘢𝘯𝘴 𝘩𝘦𝘢𝘷𝘪𝘭𝘺 𝘪𝘯𝘵𝘰 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘷𝘦𝘳𝘺 𝘴𝘵𝘳𝘰𝘯𝘨 𝘳𝘶𝘭𝘦𝘴 𝘢𝘨𝘢𝘪𝘯𝘴𝘵 𝘷𝘪𝘦𝘸𝘱𝘰𝘪𝘯𝘵 𝘥𝘪𝘴𝘤𝘳𝘪𝘮𝘪𝘯𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯.
𝘚𝘶𝘤𝘩 𝘭𝘢𝘸𝘴, 𝘒𝘢𝘨𝘢𝘯 𝘸𝘳𝘪𝘵𝘦𝘴, 𝘢𝘳𝘦 𝘢𝘯 “‘𝘦𝘨𝘳𝘦𝘨𝘪𝘰𝘶𝘴 𝘧𝘰𝘳𝘮’ 𝘰𝘧 𝘤𝘰𝘯𝘵𝘦𝘯𝘵-𝘣𝘢𝘴𝘦𝘥 𝘳𝘦𝘨𝘶𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯,” 𝘪𝘯 𝘱𝘢𝘳𝘵 𝘣𝘦𝘤𝘢𝘶𝘴𝘦 𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘺 𝘴𝘶𝘨𝘨𝘦𝘴𝘵 𝘵𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘨𝘰𝘷𝘦𝘳𝘯𝘮𝘦𝘯𝘵 𝘩𝘢𝘥 𝘢𝘯 “𝘪𝘮𝘱𝘦𝘳𝘮𝘪𝘴𝘴𝘪𝘣𝘭𝘦 𝘮𝘰𝘵𝘪𝘷𝘦” 𝘸𝘩𝘦𝘯 𝘪𝘵 𝘸𝘳𝘰𝘵𝘦 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘭𝘢𝘸 — “𝘳𝘦𝘨𝘶𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘴𝘱𝘦𝘦𝘤𝘩 𝘣𝘦𝘤𝘢𝘶𝘴𝘦 𝘰𝘧 𝘪𝘵𝘴 𝘰𝘸𝘯 ‘𝘩𝘰𝘴𝘵𝘪𝘭𝘪𝘵𝘺’ 𝘵𝘰𝘸𝘢𝘳𝘥𝘴 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘵𝘢𝘳𝘨𝘦𝘵𝘦𝘥 𝘮𝘦𝘴𝘴𝘢𝘨𝘦𝘴.” 𝘍𝘰𝘳 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘴 𝘳𝘦𝘢𝘴𝘰𝘯, 𝘒𝘢𝘨𝘢𝘯 𝘸𝘳𝘪𝘵𝘦𝘴, 𝘭𝘢𝘸𝘴 𝘵𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘦𝘯𝘨𝘢𝘨𝘦 𝘪𝘯 𝘷𝘪𝘦𝘸𝘱𝘰𝘪𝘯𝘵 𝘥𝘪𝘴𝘤𝘳𝘪𝘮𝘪𝘯𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯 𝘰𝘧 𝘢𝘯𝘺 𝘬𝘪𝘯𝘥 “𝘢𝘳𝘦 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘮𝘰𝘴𝘵 𝘴𝘶𝘴𝘱𝘦𝘤𝘵 𝘰𝘧 𝘢𝘭𝘭 𝘴𝘱𝘦𝘦𝘤𝘩 𝘳𝘦𝘨𝘶𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯𝘴.”
He also notes that licensed therapists who engage in such practices can still be disciplined by their licensing organizations (just like lawyers can be disbarred for advising clients to commit crimes), and they can also be subject to malpractice suits.
https://www.vox.com/politics/484391/supreme-court-chiles-salazar-conversion-therapy
"He also notes that licensed therapists who engage in such practices can still be disciplined by their licensing organizations (just like lawyers can be disbarred for advising clients to commit crimes), and they can also be subject to malpractice suits."
Yes, but only AFTER they've hurt a shitload of kids. And while you're going after this bunch, there will be a new crop of "therapists" popping up to take their place. It will continue despite the fact that we KNOW what they are doing is harmful to kids. And if the behavior is forever protected by the Constitution, there's nothing lawmakers can ever do about it.
1A for Nazis but not for them evillllllle GHEYZ. Yeah. We got that.
What steaming mandrill shit!!!!!!!!!!
I am not a lawyer, but I can also think of some arguments to back the idea that this regulation is still needed despite that. So I would assume real lawyers are already writing briefs to that effect for when this goes back to the lower court.
Wingers always claim the Left is suppressing their Freeze Peach. By which they mean, they want to be free to disseminate every hateful, harmful, ignorant thing that floats around their heads. But it does not go both ways: you shouldn't get to have a Pride festival, for example, or be a drag queen in public, or be visible as a trans person.
And that's why the 1A needs re-worked. We need "human dignity" laws like in Germany and others.
You want to be hateful? Fine. Keep your drooling mouth shut about it in public. You don't get to shred the social contract, you subhuman beasts.