To me, the flag is just a piece of cloth. I have felt that way all my life. The idea that "desecrating" a piece of cloth should be treated as a crime is just ludicrous.
The problem with being woke is that we believe that everyone has inalienable rights, even assholes who, given a little power, want to body slam us and yell, "Booyah!"
The guy burning the flag in the park was NOT arrested for "flag-burning," as this story implies. He was arrested because you are not allowed to set fires in the park. They cited him and he was released. Nothing about Trump's EO.
I remarked to a friend of mine this morning (who lives on a houseboat in the D.C. Basin) about the 'flag burning epidemic' that I am totally unaware of.........at least it made her laugh.....
Scalia, at least in that moment, understood that his personal bias against liberals or hippies expressing outrage against the government was irrelevant to the issue at hand. It’s free speech. It’s probably THE most vital and precious example of free speech - the freedom to openly criticize your government and elected officials. We elect them, they work for us and represent us. We pay them with tax dollars. But Trump 2.0 is all about giving the middle finger to the constitution and We The People. Trump enjoys it, but we need to understand that Trump is ever the pawn, exploited for his cult of personality through flattery, power, attention and impunity. But this attack on democratic norms and rights is much larger than just Trump. He’s almost 80 and will only be here so long. The far right, Project 2025 faction of his administration are trying to permanently reshape American culture and lay the groundwork to never cede power again through openly illegal gerrymandering, intimidation and corruption. Throughout history, other fragile democracies have faltered when autocrats ignored laws and norms and robbed the people of their voice and voting rights. Change then only came through collapse, coups, and violence. Trump and his toadies know this, and thus the use of national guard to quell “civil unrest,” and now to arrest people who protest.
You should not burn flags without proper fire extinguishers nearby, because flags nowadays are made of nylon more often than not, and they just melt and light other shit on fire. Fartknocker, back me up here man!
Ta, Robyn. That Thing in the Offal Office really, truly is stuck in the past. I haven't even heard of anyone burning an American flag in these Untied States in decades.
Remember, at every protest, No Kings, 50501, AOT, K, chant the following and get others to do so:
Epstein. Epstein! Epstein!! EPSTEIN!!! repeated ad infinitum.
As a sandal-wearing, scruffy-bearded weirdo, I can't endorse scalia for anything other than the position he currently holds, for which he's gaining recognition.
Justice Scalia died almost ten years ago and he was inconsistent in the way he applied his "originalism" but he did defend the notion that free speech was not limited to verbal utterances but could be extended to physical acts like burning a flag.
OK, OK, I do realize it's maybe not too bright to ask a logical question about someone who is a stranger to logic. But the last time I looked, the only legal way to dispose of an American flag which has been so severely damaged that it is no longer serviceable is by burning. Just imaging landfills full of tattered, torn, stained American flags. Yuck. I'm sure he has no alternate suggestion.
In any case, I see flags left out in storms and left hanging all night. As a kid I was taught that those are things we aren't supposed to do. Some flags have been outside for years, faded and tattered.
Yes, and this was particularly obvious (and offensive) when people were putting little flags on little poles on their vehicles. Those took a beating 24/7. And IIRC most belonged to people on the far right. As a veteran, I cringed at every one I saw.
I don't care. To me, it's a piece of cloth. Revering inanimate objects as being symbolic of something is a form of idolatry. I don't understand why you cringed, especially "as a veteran." You did not fight for a flag. You fought for every person living in America.
Well, it was an involuntary response. Service members are taught more abut the flag code than most people, and trained to show respect through honoring it. You may be right that it's a form of idolatry - but if so, then dishonoring it becomes a form of blasphemy. HOnestly, proests don't bother me - those I understand. It's carelessness that is modt disrespectfuk IMO.
Putting up flags but never taking them down. Wearing clothing with flag prints (especially intimate clothing.) Also, remember, the people who are doing these things are people who really do idolize a piece of cloth.
An appropriate respect for one's own flag is not in itself a bad thing. It helps one learn to respect other nations' flags and symbols, which leads to the ability to respect people of other nations. You may not need that kind of education - but there are definitely people who do.
Akshully, it is appropriate under Canadian flag code to shred flags no longer in service because of age. This is because, as I previously stated, flags are often made of nylon and so they melt instead of burn. I don’t know US code but they usually coordinate, or at least they did. You still can’t let them touch the ground but you can shred them. Yes, they make a shredder for that.
Look, I have a weird job, ok, I had to look up how to dispose of flags without burning.
A lot of flags sold to individuals and possibly private agencies of various kinds are synthetic, I expect. But I think the Government is still using cotton. I was going to say "Flags that burn still exist, or it wouldn't be an issue" - but with this idiot and his idiotic regime, you never know.
You may well be right. Although apparently he got this bug up his posterior because someone did burn a flag in front of him - and apparently it did burn. I'm a veteran, and I'd not be pleased if my survivors (if I had any) were handed a nylon flag at my funeral - not that I would know about it at that point.
I’m in Canada so ymmv. But up here even government flags are primarily nylon. They last longer and fade slower I believe.
Tangerine Hitler perpetually thinks it’s 1982 and he’ll see Liza at 54 tonight so it’s hard to say that he’s leaping on an issue that still exists. It’d be weirder if it did exist probably. Like I say though, I’m Canadian so what do I know?
Back when Westboro Baptist Church was a thing, they took their road show to Canada to protest whatever it was they were protesting that day and tried to burn a Canadian flag on Parliament grounds. The helpful Mountie loaned them a Bic lighter, then ticketed them for an illegal burning and violating air pollution laws. Anyway, most flags these days are made of flame retardant fabric, so it's not exactly a ... ahem.. burning issue. no should it be-
Are other countries so weird about their flags, or is it just us? My only reference point is Ankh-Morpork, and by extension the UK, which mocks flag worship.
Here in Oz flags are usually found flying only at Government offices, with a particularly huge one flying over Parliament Househttps://www.aph.gov.au/Visit_Parliament/Things_to_Do/Take_in_some_history
. A private citizen flying the flag is regarded as uncouth at best, suspicious at worst, except on Australia Day and Anzac Day
State schools yes, private schools maybe. Also, we rarely fly the Oz flag alone. It's usually flanked by the First Nations/Aboriginal flag and the Torres Straits Island flag
Some flag fetishism here in Mexico, though it's probably just one of those unfortunate gringo influence. Some of it's just flexing. Juarez and El Paso used to have a competition for flying the biggest flag in the world. Juarez won.
We also have the giant flag flying on the Zocalo in front of the national palace, and a ceremony every evening as it's lowered for the night. The damn thing is so huge, it take a line of soldiers to grab it as it's lowered, which makes it fun to watch on a windy day, when the last guy in line sometimes ends up airborne.
To me, the flag is just a piece of cloth. I have felt that way all my life. The idea that "desecrating" a piece of cloth should be treated as a crime is just ludicrous.
I once saw a a fireworks display where the finale included fireworks that formed an image of the American flag.
TO WHOM DO I REPORT THIS?
The problem with being woke is that we believe that everyone has inalienable rights, even assholes who, given a little power, want to body slam us and yell, "Booyah!"
The guy burning the flag in the park was NOT arrested for "flag-burning," as this story implies. He was arrested because you are not allowed to set fires in the park. They cited him and he was released. Nothing about Trump's EO.
I remarked to a friend of mine this morning (who lives on a houseboat in the D.C. Basin) about the 'flag burning epidemic' that I am totally unaware of.........at least it made her laugh.....
Scalia, at least in that moment, understood that his personal bias against liberals or hippies expressing outrage against the government was irrelevant to the issue at hand. It’s free speech. It’s probably THE most vital and precious example of free speech - the freedom to openly criticize your government and elected officials. We elect them, they work for us and represent us. We pay them with tax dollars. But Trump 2.0 is all about giving the middle finger to the constitution and We The People. Trump enjoys it, but we need to understand that Trump is ever the pawn, exploited for his cult of personality through flattery, power, attention and impunity. But this attack on democratic norms and rights is much larger than just Trump. He’s almost 80 and will only be here so long. The far right, Project 2025 faction of his administration are trying to permanently reshape American culture and lay the groundwork to never cede power again through openly illegal gerrymandering, intimidation and corruption. Throughout history, other fragile democracies have faltered when autocrats ignored laws and norms and robbed the people of their voice and voting rights. Change then only came through collapse, coups, and violence. Trump and his toadies know this, and thus the use of national guard to quell “civil unrest,” and now to arrest people who protest.
Scalia has many flaws in his jurisprudence but he was pretty consistent in his defense of the First Amendment.
You should not burn flags without proper fire extinguishers nearby, because flags nowadays are made of nylon more often than not, and they just melt and light other shit on fire. Fartknocker, back me up here man!
Once again the party that stands up more often for protecting property over people gets upset by an inanimate object being damaged.
MAGA defends inanimate objects because they won't sass them back.
Ta, Robyn. That Thing in the Offal Office really, truly is stuck in the past. I haven't even heard of anyone burning an American flag in these Untied States in decades.
Remember, at every protest, No Kings, 50501, AOT, K, chant the following and get others to do so:
Epstein. Epstein! Epstein!! EPSTEIN!!! repeated ad infinitum.
I guess somebody did it recently at a protest, and it triggered the patriotic impulses of ol' General Bonespurs.
As a sandal-wearing, scruffy-bearded weirdo, I can't endorse scalia for anything other than the position he currently holds, for which he's gaining recognition.
Justice Scalia died almost ten years ago and he was inconsistent in the way he applied his "originalism" but he did defend the notion that free speech was not limited to verbal utterances but could be extended to physical acts like burning a flag.
"Gianni Rotten."
skinner out
OK, OK, I do realize it's maybe not too bright to ask a logical question about someone who is a stranger to logic. But the last time I looked, the only legal way to dispose of an American flag which has been so severely damaged that it is no longer serviceable is by burning. Just imaging landfills full of tattered, torn, stained American flags. Yuck. I'm sure he has no alternate suggestion.
In any case, I see flags left out in storms and left hanging all night. As a kid I was taught that those are things we aren't supposed to do. Some flags have been outside for years, faded and tattered.
Yes, and this was particularly obvious (and offensive) when people were putting little flags on little poles on their vehicles. Those took a beating 24/7. And IIRC most belonged to people on the far right. As a veteran, I cringed at every one I saw.
I don't care. To me, it's a piece of cloth. Revering inanimate objects as being symbolic of something is a form of idolatry. I don't understand why you cringed, especially "as a veteran." You did not fight for a flag. You fought for every person living in America.
Well, it was an involuntary response. Service members are taught more abut the flag code than most people, and trained to show respect through honoring it. You may be right that it's a form of idolatry - but if so, then dishonoring it becomes a form of blasphemy. HOnestly, proests don't bother me - those I understand. It's carelessness that is modt disrespectfuk IMO.
I know. My sister was in the Air Force and she told me about the flag love bullshit. What carelessness are you referring to?
Putting up flags but never taking them down. Wearing clothing with flag prints (especially intimate clothing.) Also, remember, the people who are doing these things are people who really do idolize a piece of cloth.
An appropriate respect for one's own flag is not in itself a bad thing. It helps one learn to respect other nations' flags and symbols, which leads to the ability to respect people of other nations. You may not need that kind of education - but there are definitely people who do.
s
Akshully, it is appropriate under Canadian flag code to shred flags no longer in service because of age. This is because, as I previously stated, flags are often made of nylon and so they melt instead of burn. I don’t know US code but they usually coordinate, or at least they did. You still can’t let them touch the ground but you can shred them. Yes, they make a shredder for that.
Look, I have a weird job, ok, I had to look up how to dispose of flags without burning.
A lot of flags sold to individuals and possibly private agencies of various kinds are synthetic, I expect. But I think the Government is still using cotton. I was going to say "Flags that burn still exist, or it wouldn't be an issue" - but with this idiot and his idiotic regime, you never know.
You may well be right. Although apparently he got this bug up his posterior because someone did burn a flag in front of him - and apparently it did burn. I'm a veteran, and I'd not be pleased if my survivors (if I had any) were handed a nylon flag at my funeral - not that I would know about it at that point.
I’m in Canada so ymmv. But up here even government flags are primarily nylon. They last longer and fade slower I believe.
Tangerine Hitler perpetually thinks it’s 1982 and he’ll see Liza at 54 tonight so it’s hard to say that he’s leaping on an issue that still exists. It’d be weirder if it did exist probably. Like I say though, I’m Canadian so what do I know?
Back when Westboro Baptist Church was a thing, they took their road show to Canada to protest whatever it was they were protesting that day and tried to burn a Canadian flag on Parliament grounds. The helpful Mountie loaned them a Bic lighter, then ticketed them for an illegal burning and violating air pollution laws. Anyway, most flags these days are made of flame retardant fabric, so it's not exactly a ... ahem.. burning issue. no should it be-
"The helpful Mountie loaned them a Bic lighter, then ticketed them for an illegal burning and violating air pollution laws."
That's the most Canadian story I have heard yet this week!
Go ahead. Quote Scalia. But understand this: You're trying to communicate with a man who struggles to understand "Piglet Meets a Heffalump".
Yes. It all turns to Pooh in the end.
Oh, very good!
Speaking of Orange's dismantling of free speech... I see he uttered a remark and Cracker Barrel is now back to their old logo.
Did they lose millions of dollars on branding they'll now throw out, or was this entire episode a marketing/appease the king effort?
Their whole business model involves sucking on a hog's anus, so....
Are other countries so weird about their flags, or is it just us? My only reference point is Ankh-Morpork, and by extension the UK, which mocks flag worship.
The Germans are pretty sensitive still about their former flag of 1935-1945.
Here in Oz flags are usually found flying only at Government offices, with a particularly huge one flying over Parliament Househttps://www.aph.gov.au/Visit_Parliament/Things_to_Do/Take_in_some_history
. A private citizen flying the flag is regarded as uncouth at best, suspicious at worst, except on Australia Day and Anzac Day
Schools?
State schools yes, private schools maybe. Also, we rarely fly the Oz flag alone. It's usually flanked by the First Nations/Aboriginal flag and the Torres Straits Island flag
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTPp83OlhSCLuOowQ09r6aZEBq0P39hsfPcPw&s
No flags on private residences?!? wHy Do YoU hAtE aUsTrAlIa?!?!?!?!? /s
Some flag fetishism here in Mexico, though it's probably just one of those unfortunate gringo influence. Some of it's just flexing. Juarez and El Paso used to have a competition for flying the biggest flag in the world. Juarez won.
We also have the giant flag flying on the Zocalo in front of the national palace, and a ceremony every evening as it's lowered for the night. The damn thing is so huge, it take a line of soldiers to grab it as it's lowered, which makes it fun to watch on a windy day, when the last guy in line sometimes ends up airborne.
Flag burning is my least favorite thing, but now I want to do it. But first I will have to grow a scruffy beard.
Then off to the stoning!</brian>