RAKEYIA SCOTT: He better live. I swear, he better live. Yep, he better live. He better fucking live. He better live. Where is...He better fucking live, and I can’t even leave the damn...I ain’t going nowhere. I’m staying in the same damn spot. What the fuck. That’s O.K. did you all call the police? I mean, did you all call an ambulance?
Yes, there are too many guns, too many addled people with guns, too few gun restrictions, BUT----black men, and boys, with guns are exponentially more likely to be killed by police than white men with guns.https://www.youtube.com/wat... (sorry about the ad embedded at the beginning of this)
I'm not sure what the point of an anecdotal video is. Data suggests that there isn't much difference. But that's not my field and that wasn't my point.
Comparing how many white people are killed by police to how many black people are killed by the police is statistically dubious unless you first adjust for population. Data shows that whites are 62% of the population and 49% of those killed by police. Blacks are 13% of the population and 24% of those killed by police. That means that black Americans are 2.5 times more likely to be shot and killed by police than white Americans. I agreed with you that there are too many guns but if you think that 2nd Amendment absolutists are going to see reason anytime soon about their arsenals then I have beachfront real estate to sell you. What CAN be changed and must be changed is police hiring and training.
Actually, that's not indicative of anything because you failed to account for interactions with police. The perpetrator is black in about 30% of crime in the US. Evidence suggests that it's much higher because of non-reporting. Percentage of population is irrelevant, you have to consider probability of getting shot conditional on an interaction with police and black people are actually less likely to get killed given that they are interacting with police although that's statistically insignificant. The best evidence is here, a result that shocked the researcher. www.nber.org/papers/w22399.pdf. This whole argument really sounds a lot like the wingnuts that scream that black people must somehow be inherently violent because they commit more crime. You are claiming that they are disproportionately shot as a percentage of population but that's just as meaningless. The single biggest indicators of criminal activity are income and educational attainment. If you economically and educationally marginalize an entire group of people those people are going to engage in more criminal activity. This entire focus on police is misguided. Stop giving everyone guns. Stop cutting funding for education and social programs. Start caring about the schools and programs available regardless of someone's income. Try giving everyone the same opportunity from birth. If you are born black in the US you are more than 2 1/2 times as likely to be born into poverty than if you are born white. People who live in poverty are more likely to drop out of school, less likely to have a marketable skill, and more likely to engage in criminal activity. That's independent of race. Anyone who thinks you have the same opportunity is just plain nuts. But seriously, stop yelling racism every time someone with a gun gets shot by the police because there is zero statistical difference in the rate of shootings given there is an interaction with police and there is no statistical difference in rate of interactions with police given the rate of involvement in criminal activity. Worry about the root causes instead.
You think I don't know and worry and do what I can about "the root causes"? Save the lecture: you're preaching to the choir. Of COURSE, people in this country don't have the same opportunities from birth. You would benefit from less academic distance and more interaction and anecdotal evidence from those people you're describing. My husband and I both chose jobs in which we do that. That's how I know about the crippled black preacher one town over who had a cop pull a gun on him because he didn't get out of the car fast enough after a traffic stop. (Fortunately, the cop had a sane partner so the preacher was not shot.) That's how I know that the white meth dealer in my town never went to jail: instead got 2 years probation: while a black pot dealer got 10 years in prison. My husband, a paramedic, got called to the scene too late to revive a black woman put in a chokehold by police after she shoplifted from WalMart. Our wealthy white neighbor's son got into a domestic with his girlfriend. When the police came, he fired at them WITH AN AK-47 and they CALLED HIS PARENTS to come talk to him. We are focusing on police because police are now the de facto social workers, medics, and psychologists who get called to any and every scene. Yes, that's a result of repeated GOP cuts of social programs. You think that money's coming back anytime soon? I don't. Those cuts have hurt black people more than white people, because white people, rich or poor, are surrounded by a cushion of privilege that they don't even acknowledge. How hard would it have been for the Charlotte police to stop and say to Mrs. Scott, "Oh, you're his wife? What's going on here, ma'am? Come talk to him." If Tamir Rice had been a 12 year old white kid playing with a REAL gun (instead of the toy that it was) would the police have zoomed up beside him and opened fire? I often see 12 year old white boys with rifles and nobody blinks an eye over it. The inequalities in this country are not just poverty based. At their deepest level, they are based on systemic racism, and the sooner we understand this the better we will be.
I cited a Washington Post study which DID account for "how often interactions occurred with police." Since you like statistical analysis, have at it. These studies parse the numbers in several different ways.
Please note the conclusion of the NBC study."Miller said the statistics show that there is far too much violence when police stop Americans in general, and he said it's up to police to do something about that.'You and I might get stopped once in our lives. The police stop people every day. They need to be the ones trained to de-escalate,' he said."
We have lived in separate worlds for a very long time. Easy to "other" each other. It's slowly changing, but far too slowly. I wish things could change for race as quickly as it has changed for LGBTQ rights.
Yes. Except that straights didn't create LGBTQ folk (I mean, other than by giving birth to them, for the most part) whereas whites created slavery and then tried their damnedest to maintain it via the institutionalized racism that still lingers today. While we still have this huge history that even "good white people" can't acknowledge because it makes them uncomfortable due to their White Guilt...yeah, change is going to take a long time.
Even people like me, raised as a good little liberal who thought she couldn't POSSIBLY be racist, finally had to admit she was when she eventually met Black people from different countries and realized she felt differently about them than about her fellow non-white citizens. I came to that realization on my own, just from living life, but there are a lot of people who still need to be MADE to feel uncomfortable and forced to examine why that is. Hopefully, they don't have to watch too many more live streaming videos of Black people being murdered for it to sink in.
How many Youtube videos have you seen of cops shooting white people? Even when angry white men are waving guns at the cops, they generally seem to be able to arrest them without shooting them.
"Evidence suggests that it's much higher because of non-reporting."Why would that be more true of black people than of white people?Seems to me that you're just another racist.
Yes, there are too many guns, too many addled people with guns, too few gun restrictions, BUT----black men, and boys, with guns are exponentially more likely to be killed by police than white men with guns.https://www.youtube.com/wat... (sorry about the ad embedded at the beginning of this)
Thank you for being in that booth.
I am always desperate to seem ever so droll when I comment here. Not this time. This is just horrific.
I'm not sure what the point of an anecdotal video is. Data suggests that there isn't much difference. But that's not my field and that wasn't my point.
Comparing how many white people are killed by police to how many black people are killed by the police is statistically dubious unless you first adjust for population. Data shows that whites are 62% of the population and 49% of those killed by police. Blacks are 13% of the population and 24% of those killed by police. That means that black Americans are 2.5 times more likely to be shot and killed by police than white Americans. I agreed with you that there are too many guns but if you think that 2nd Amendment absolutists are going to see reason anytime soon about their arsenals then I have beachfront real estate to sell you. What CAN be changed and must be changed is police hiring and training.
https://uploads.disquscdn.c...
Except that white cops seem to be perfectly capable of arresting armed white men without anyone being shot.
Anecdotal.
Actually, that's not indicative of anything because you failed to account for interactions with police. The perpetrator is black in about 30% of crime in the US. Evidence suggests that it's much higher because of non-reporting. Percentage of population is irrelevant, you have to consider probability of getting shot conditional on an interaction with police and black people are actually less likely to get killed given that they are interacting with police although that's statistically insignificant. The best evidence is here, a result that shocked the researcher. www.nber.org/papers/w22399.pdf. This whole argument really sounds a lot like the wingnuts that scream that black people must somehow be inherently violent because they commit more crime. You are claiming that they are disproportionately shot as a percentage of population but that's just as meaningless. The single biggest indicators of criminal activity are income and educational attainment. If you economically and educationally marginalize an entire group of people those people are going to engage in more criminal activity. This entire focus on police is misguided. Stop giving everyone guns. Stop cutting funding for education and social programs. Start caring about the schools and programs available regardless of someone's income. Try giving everyone the same opportunity from birth. If you are born black in the US you are more than 2 1/2 times as likely to be born into poverty than if you are born white. People who live in poverty are more likely to drop out of school, less likely to have a marketable skill, and more likely to engage in criminal activity. That's independent of race. Anyone who thinks you have the same opportunity is just plain nuts. But seriously, stop yelling racism every time someone with a gun gets shot by the police because there is zero statistical difference in the rate of shootings given there is an interaction with police and there is no statistical difference in rate of interactions with police given the rate of involvement in criminal activity. Worry about the root causes instead.
You think I don't know and worry and do what I can about "the root causes"? Save the lecture: you're preaching to the choir. Of COURSE, people in this country don't have the same opportunities from birth. You would benefit from less academic distance and more interaction and anecdotal evidence from those people you're describing. My husband and I both chose jobs in which we do that. That's how I know about the crippled black preacher one town over who had a cop pull a gun on him because he didn't get out of the car fast enough after a traffic stop. (Fortunately, the cop had a sane partner so the preacher was not shot.) That's how I know that the white meth dealer in my town never went to jail: instead got 2 years probation: while a black pot dealer got 10 years in prison. My husband, a paramedic, got called to the scene too late to revive a black woman put in a chokehold by police after she shoplifted from WalMart. Our wealthy white neighbor's son got into a domestic with his girlfriend. When the police came, he fired at them WITH AN AK-47 and they CALLED HIS PARENTS to come talk to him. We are focusing on police because police are now the de facto social workers, medics, and psychologists who get called to any and every scene. Yes, that's a result of repeated GOP cuts of social programs. You think that money's coming back anytime soon? I don't. Those cuts have hurt black people more than white people, because white people, rich or poor, are surrounded by a cushion of privilege that they don't even acknowledge. How hard would it have been for the Charlotte police to stop and say to Mrs. Scott, "Oh, you're his wife? What's going on here, ma'am? Come talk to him." If Tamir Rice had been a 12 year old white kid playing with a REAL gun (instead of the toy that it was) would the police have zoomed up beside him and opened fire? I often see 12 year old white boys with rifles and nobody blinks an eye over it. The inequalities in this country are not just poverty based. At their deepest level, they are based on systemic racism, and the sooner we understand this the better we will be.
I cited a Washington Post study which DID account for "how often interactions occurred with police." Since you like statistical analysis, have at it. These studies parse the numbers in several different ways.
http://touch.latimes.com/#s...http://www.motherjones.com/...http://www.nytimes.com/2016...https://www.theguardian.com...http://www.nbcnews.com/heal...http://www.snopes.com/do-po...
Please note the conclusion of the NBC study."Miller said the statistics show that there is far too much violence when police stop Americans in general, and he said it's up to police to do something about that.'You and I might get stopped once in our lives. The police stop people every day. They need to be the ones trained to de-escalate,' he said."
We have lived in separate worlds for a very long time. Easy to "other" each other. It's slowly changing, but far too slowly. I wish things could change for race as quickly as it has changed for LGBTQ rights.
Yes. Except that straights didn't create LGBTQ folk (I mean, other than by giving birth to them, for the most part) whereas whites created slavery and then tried their damnedest to maintain it via the institutionalized racism that still lingers today. While we still have this huge history that even "good white people" can't acknowledge because it makes them uncomfortable due to their White Guilt...yeah, change is going to take a long time.
Even people like me, raised as a good little liberal who thought she couldn't POSSIBLY be racist, finally had to admit she was when she eventually met Black people from different countries and realized she felt differently about them than about her fellow non-white citizens. I came to that realization on my own, just from living life, but there are a lot of people who still need to be MADE to feel uncomfortable and forced to examine why that is. Hopefully, they don't have to watch too many more live streaming videos of Black people being murdered for it to sink in.
How many Youtube videos have you seen of cops shooting white people? Even when angry white men are waving guns at the cops, they generally seem to be able to arrest them without shooting them.
"Evidence suggests that it's much higher because of non-reporting."Why would that be more true of black people than of white people?Seems to me that you're just another racist.
Well said.