Trump loves to accuse literally everyone else of fraud. He was calling msm “fake news” from the start, knowing he couldn’t possibly defend his lies, or keep up with the fact-checking. So he attacked the entire institution of journalism, and he caused incalculable harm. So it’s fitting, and it’s poetically just, that he be found guilty of fraud. HE is the fraud. HE is the cheat. HE is corrupt. HE is impossibly dishonest. And his actions and words divided this country more deeply than any time since the Civil War.
I recently read a short article by a lawyer, advising prosecutors what worked for her when she was arguing against Trump.
I don't remember her name or the details -- and of course I can't find the article to link to now -- but I thought her advice was fairly astute.
She said he LIVES for confrontation and being obnoxious, so if you're confrontational towards him, you're giving him exactly what he hopes for -- the excuse to escalate, yell, and be a belligerent jackass.
What she did ahead of time while they were waiting (and I'm paraphrasing a bit here) was ask him a bunch of bullshit questions about how his kids were doing, where he went on vacation, etc., told him he was handsome and she liked his tie... "And I can't believe this, but IT ACTUALLY WORKED!" He was so dumb that her fake attempt at pretending that "we're all on the same team" fooled him, and so needy that her fake offhand flattery made him (forgive the mental picture) fall on his back with his legs in the air.
She said he basically gave away the store because she faked being "nice" to him.
And yes, there was a picture, and yes, she is a young, attractive woman -- but I think her point stands.
When you don’t have the law, facts, or even a jury to manipulate, you don’t just pound the table, you scream, panic and hurl your own poop at the judge. This is a BENCH trial. Trump has done everything in his power to anger this judge, probably worse than ever in his judicial career. He’s already ruled Trump is guilty of fraud, because, duh. I actually do agree with Trump on one key argument. His value in business dealings was always about much more than numbers. That is surely true. Trump borrowed hundreds of millions from several banks because of who he is. Those institutions DID need real collateral and real proof of asset values to responsibly loan money. But they loaned far more money than would otherwise be justified or supported by the borrower’s assets or ability to repay. That’s why he defaulted so often. He gambled on businesses. Some made money, many did not. Through it all, Trump was moving tens and hundreds of millions around. Borrowing, investing, paying some of it back, and defaulting often. The banks and lenders were undoubtedly starstruck, over-confident or in some cases perhaps flat out corrupt, conspiring with Trump to grant loans they would never approve to a less magnanimous borrower with similar resources. Pats on the back, boxes of cigars, access to Trump and Trump’s contacts, his world. No doubt bankers wanted that. Trump was always a prick, just not as obviously, nakedly horrible as the potus spotlight exposed. But Trump always thought he was above the laws and rules that applied to small people. And now he’s guilty of fraud, likely to be banned from doing business in NY for the few years he probably has left. And he’s daring the Judge to throw the book at him. Judge Engoran will be very careful in writing his opinion. I’m guessing Trump is penalized $100 million. He will panic, he will vilify the judge and his staff. Those people might even get hurt. He will appeal in a desperate hope of finding not justice, but a favorable maga court to ignore the facts and “do him a favor.”
You are spot on. And for too long he WAS above the law. Or at least, he could manipulate his way through all the available loopholes so that he was effectively untouched by the law.
When you're acting criminally, don't put yourself in the spotlight. He violated the golden rule of crime for his own vanity, and now he can reap the rewards. FAFO, you orange fool.
Man I love Simpsons first 10 seasons. I lost interest around season 11 or 12. The writing changed, and seemed less original to me. But there are 100 quotes or more in the seasons 3-10 that I just love. I hadn’t heard this one from season 2, but it made me laugh! “Yeah, but don’t say it like that.” Lol.
Trump admitted on the stand today that he saw and signed off on the evaluations. No, he didn't DO the evaluations but if he disagreed with them, why would he admit that he signed off on them if they were fraudulent? That goes right to the heart of the AG's case.
Q: Did you ever think that the values were off in your statement of financial condition?
A: Yes, on occasion. Both high and low.
I'm no Judge and not a lawyer, but I believe that is an admission!
Hi Wonkers! I am very confused about this Alina Habba (sp?) person. Wasn't she a strip-mall lawyer who just happened to be in biz near Bedminster? Obvs. I can do the deep dive but would like to hear some pithy comments :) Thx
From electoral vote dot com: "Habba took her law degree at Widener University Commonwealth Law School, which is ranked 159th of the 192 law schools in the country. Do with that information what you will."
My theory is that TFG hired her because he wanted to boink her.
I read that too. Attorneys make mistakes, but yeesh. As an attorney one of THE most basic things you do at the start of each case is decide if you want a bench or jury trial. $85 is the jury fee in my jurisdiction. I can see Trump absolutely suing his attorney for malpractice for that oversight. Surely he wishes he could be manipulating a jury right now with his theatrics instead of one very angry judge. Habba may have inadvertently helped in one respect with her goof. Higher courts look mostly for legal errors. They rarely interfere with factual findings by juries. They sometimes consider lowering or raising an award of damages if the award is not supported by the facts. But findings by this judge could be scrutinized by right-leaning appellate judges, no doubt.
Is this televised, or is he at the mercy of a courtroom sketch artist? Either way, I REALLY really wanna see all the faces he was making while speechifyin'. A caricaturist's delight!
So I tried to talk to my Trumpy Neighbor about this. It went about as well as Trump's testimony did.
First she said, "They just want to keep him from running for President." I didn't bother to mention that this investigation started long before Trump indicated he'd be running again, and also, that his poll numbers seem to go up every time there's a new case against him.
I ventured that I was trying to follow the EVIDENCE.
Since Trumpy types rarely pay attention to what he says or the specifics of what he’s accused of, you should just ask your neighbor things like, “What about Trump admitting he wanted to bone his daughter?” or “Can you believe Trump called his followers stupid in testimony?”
I've tried things like that. Not those specifically, but she shakes her head and says she'd have to see him say that for herself in order to believe it. And then--she completely lacks the curiosity to go look for these things online.
Trump loves to accuse literally everyone else of fraud. He was calling msm “fake news” from the start, knowing he couldn’t possibly defend his lies, or keep up with the fact-checking. So he attacked the entire institution of journalism, and he caused incalculable harm. So it’s fitting, and it’s poetically just, that he be found guilty of fraud. HE is the fraud. HE is the cheat. HE is corrupt. HE is impossibly dishonest. And his actions and words divided this country more deeply than any time since the Civil War.
I recently read a short article by a lawyer, advising prosecutors what worked for her when she was arguing against Trump.
I don't remember her name or the details -- and of course I can't find the article to link to now -- but I thought her advice was fairly astute.
She said he LIVES for confrontation and being obnoxious, so if you're confrontational towards him, you're giving him exactly what he hopes for -- the excuse to escalate, yell, and be a belligerent jackass.
What she did ahead of time while they were waiting (and I'm paraphrasing a bit here) was ask him a bunch of bullshit questions about how his kids were doing, where he went on vacation, etc., told him he was handsome and she liked his tie... "And I can't believe this, but IT ACTUALLY WORKED!" He was so dumb that her fake attempt at pretending that "we're all on the same team" fooled him, and so needy that her fake offhand flattery made him (forgive the mental picture) fall on his back with his legs in the air.
She said he basically gave away the store because she faked being "nice" to him.
And yes, there was a picture, and yes, she is a young, attractive woman -- but I think her point stands.
When you don’t have the law, facts, or even a jury to manipulate, you don’t just pound the table, you scream, panic and hurl your own poop at the judge. This is a BENCH trial. Trump has done everything in his power to anger this judge, probably worse than ever in his judicial career. He’s already ruled Trump is guilty of fraud, because, duh. I actually do agree with Trump on one key argument. His value in business dealings was always about much more than numbers. That is surely true. Trump borrowed hundreds of millions from several banks because of who he is. Those institutions DID need real collateral and real proof of asset values to responsibly loan money. But they loaned far more money than would otherwise be justified or supported by the borrower’s assets or ability to repay. That’s why he defaulted so often. He gambled on businesses. Some made money, many did not. Through it all, Trump was moving tens and hundreds of millions around. Borrowing, investing, paying some of it back, and defaulting often. The banks and lenders were undoubtedly starstruck, over-confident or in some cases perhaps flat out corrupt, conspiring with Trump to grant loans they would never approve to a less magnanimous borrower with similar resources. Pats on the back, boxes of cigars, access to Trump and Trump’s contacts, his world. No doubt bankers wanted that. Trump was always a prick, just not as obviously, nakedly horrible as the potus spotlight exposed. But Trump always thought he was above the laws and rules that applied to small people. And now he’s guilty of fraud, likely to be banned from doing business in NY for the few years he probably has left. And he’s daring the Judge to throw the book at him. Judge Engoran will be very careful in writing his opinion. I’m guessing Trump is penalized $100 million. He will panic, he will vilify the judge and his staff. Those people might even get hurt. He will appeal in a desperate hope of finding not justice, but a favorable maga court to ignore the facts and “do him a favor.”
You are spot on. And for too long he WAS above the law. Or at least, he could manipulate his way through all the available loopholes so that he was effectively untouched by the law.
When you're acting criminally, don't put yourself in the spotlight. He violated the golden rule of crime for his own vanity, and now he can reap the rewards. FAFO, you orange fool.
Bart: Geeks sit in the front. From now on, you sit in the back row. That goes for school and church too.
Martin: Why?
Bart: So no one can see what you're doing.
Martin: I understand. The potential for mischief varies inversely with proximity to the authority figure.
Bart: Yeah, but don't say it like that.
Man I love Simpsons first 10 seasons. I lost interest around season 11 or 12. The writing changed, and seemed less original to me. But there are 100 quotes or more in the seasons 3-10 that I just love. I hadn’t heard this one from season 2, but it made me laugh! “Yeah, but don’t say it like that.” Lol.
"Trump’s balance sheet put its value at $426 million to $612 million — a number Trump testified he thought was too low."
It was too low. It was worth hundreds of millions. The classified information was *priceless*.
The fucking shitty resort hotel is maybe worth 10M.
Two Corinthians walk into a bar.
Bartender: Hello, gents. What'll it be?
FIRST CORINTHIAN: Whattya got on tap?
BARTENDER: We only carry one the brand: Donaldweiser. It's The Real Pain of Sham Beer.
C1: Then I'll have tall, cool Donald.
C2: And I'll have an exact same tall, cool Donald.
B: You know, you guys look alike.
C1: We get that a lot. It's more than just the similar raiment. I guess it's because we're both Corinthians.
C2: And we both date Thessalonians. Very young Thessalonians.
C1: Very, *very* young Thessalonians. We brag about it at Boy Scout Jamborees.
C2: And wherever hostile foreign strongmen gather. We're like two peas in a pod.
C1: But there is a big difference between us. I'm a Palm Beach, Florida tax assessor.
C2: And I'm a Loan Officer für eine große internationale Bank. So how much for the beers?
B: For you, Mr. First Corinthian, thirty-five cents.
C1: That's low, indeed!
B: And for you, Mr. Second Corinthian, $380 million.
C1 & C2: Why the wildly varying values?
B: Well it's like this, something something, accountants, something pouring drywall, something Brand.
C1: Hey, this beer looks like a sewer rat got a bad slice of pizza and voided his bowels.
C2: Same here, only I would have guessed a rabid bat.
The Bartend points to a large sign above the bar that reads: TRUMP'S
B: You know what they say. Everything Trump touches turns to shit.
NORM: Evening, everybody.
EVERYBODY: Norm! ..an Vincent Peale!
Cue Song:
♫ Faking your way through Court today,
Takes all the nerve you got.
Screaming and lying your fool head off,
Sure does work a lot.
You always want to get your way.
Sometimes you want go,
And flip the bird off at the ju-u-udge.
And give your daughter's butt a nu-u-udge.
Sometimes you lie and lie and lie,
And ketchup bottles freely fly.
You want to go where suckers feel,
Somehow, they're in the game,
You want to go,
Where everyone screams your name. ♫
Trump admitted on the stand today that he saw and signed off on the evaluations. No, he didn't DO the evaluations but if he disagreed with them, why would he admit that he signed off on them if they were fraudulent? That goes right to the heart of the AG's case.
Q: Did you ever think that the values were off in your statement of financial condition?
A: Yes, on occasion. Both high and low.
I'm no Judge and not a lawyer, but I believe that is an admission!
If Trump wasn't so dangerous, he'd be pathetic.
His insecurity is shining through...
Hi Wonkers! I am very confused about this Alina Habba (sp?) person. Wasn't she a strip-mall lawyer who just happened to be in biz near Bedminster? Obvs. I can do the deep dive but would like to hear some pithy comments :) Thx
From electoral vote dot com: "Habba took her law degree at Widener University Commonwealth Law School, which is ranked 159th of the 192 law schools in the country. Do with that information what you will."
My theory is that TFG hired her because he wanted to boink her.
I agree with that theory! To the extent that he could boink anything, can one actually imagine :((
The attorney Habba who FORGOT to ask for a jury trial? That one?
I thought that was sort of debunked. Or maybe it was just the accusation that she fogot to check the box on a form that was debunked.
I read that too. Attorneys make mistakes, but yeesh. As an attorney one of THE most basic things you do at the start of each case is decide if you want a bench or jury trial. $85 is the jury fee in my jurisdiction. I can see Trump absolutely suing his attorney for malpractice for that oversight. Surely he wishes he could be manipulating a jury right now with his theatrics instead of one very angry judge. Habba may have inadvertently helped in one respect with her goof. Higher courts look mostly for legal errors. They rarely interfere with factual findings by juries. They sometimes consider lowering or raising an award of damages if the award is not supported by the facts. But findings by this judge could be scrutinized by right-leaning appellate judges, no doubt.
Exactly! :))
For the record, it is Trump who valued the property at 18 million for tax purposes
Yeah, but that was just a lie to save money on taxes. Republicans don’t believe in paying taxes. That’s tyranny.
Is this televised, or is he at the mercy of a courtroom sketch artist? Either way, I REALLY really wanna see all the faces he was making while speechifyin'. A caricaturist's delight!
I wish it were being video'd. Court Cam of this would be a whole episode.
As the old, old saying goes: When the law is on your side, pound the law! When the facts are on your side, pound the facts!
When neither is on your side, pound the table!
In reality-land, Habba's got nothing, so she's pounding the table.
I'd just as soon she pounded sand
Such a tycoon!!!!!
https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2022-05-18/trump-business-partners-outline-his-failed-deals
His brand is so valuable that owners of buildings bearing it have been pulling it down and dragging it to the local landfill for years.
"Shut him up or I'm gonna Bobby Seale his ass!"
-Judge Engoron (in his head)
anyone else would've been Bobby Seale'd (and Abbie Hoffman'd and Jerry Rubin'd) long, long ago.
So I tried to talk to my Trumpy Neighbor about this. It went about as well as Trump's testimony did.
First she said, "They just want to keep him from running for President." I didn't bother to mention that this investigation started long before Trump indicated he'd be running again, and also, that his poll numbers seem to go up every time there's a new case against him.
I ventured that I was trying to follow the EVIDENCE.
She said, "The evidence is false."
Why waste the energy?
I don't spend a lot of energy. I try to spend a few minutes trying to inject a note of sanity.
Since Trumpy types rarely pay attention to what he says or the specifics of what he’s accused of, you should just ask your neighbor things like, “What about Trump admitting he wanted to bone his daughter?” or “Can you believe Trump called his followers stupid in testimony?”
I've tried things like that. Not those specifically, but she shakes her head and says she'd have to see him say that for herself in order to believe it. And then--she completely lacks the curiosity to go look for these things online.
There is lies the rub.
MAGAt: I have to see it with my own eyes. *shown video*. It isn't real.
There is no getting around the Trump worship.
Literally anybody: *shows video*
MAGA [blinks, then]: "I don't CARE."
Jordan Klepper used to be the master of pinning these idiots down.
"I'm the greatest most powerful leader in the world, the best deal-maker and I know more about business than anyone!"
"Oh, I didn't pay attention to the figures, I just signed what the accountants told me to sign."
I knew it was correct because I told them the numbers to fill in.