For every action, there is a reaction. In response to Wednesday's national school walkouts meant to protest the fact that our country's lax gun control laws are contributing to the scourge of mass shootings, many people chose instead to advocate that students
I couldn't agree more but in this country if the kids had walked out in protest of gun regulations and raising the age limits the "adults" would have applauded it as a God given right. It's a lot of retired military around here and locals that have been here for centuries. There's a forum - somd.com and some nastiest people in the world reside there with a hatred for democrats that exceeds fox news. I don't read it anymore - I need some peace in what's left of my life.
Robyn... This is the best and most accurate piece I have ever read, on bullying. Thanks for being one person who gets it. It is not the little wallflower waif, teased and sad, who goes on a rampage. It is usually the asshole who is also a bully, who tortures pets and fantasizes torturing women, who shoot up the place.
Suddenly the rightwing is all concerned with bullying. Blaming the victims is preferable to grabbing guns, to these psycholoons. When schools have wanted to have anti bullying classes, the rightwing has opposed them, ALWAYS, in the past. I think Frothy Santorum was the one who claimed a little bullying might straighten a sissy boy out. It may have been Dead Pat Robertson. It was one of those Morons. ... but now that the focus on guns is so strong the kids are walking out of school rather than being willing to be shot, the hypocritical psychopathic Rightwingers are all concerned about bullying.
Ugh. This country nauseates me. Humans nauseate me. Often.
exactly. preach! and these little ones are just living out what they see at home, so this really is a pipe dream to put the burden on them to act like fully mature and empathetic humans. they just want to go outside and play for godsake, not be the class psychologist.
Psychopathy is “anti-social” because it is a fundamental lack of empathy. It is not social isolation; indeed it is social manipulation in a way that can make the psychopath seem highly social and well-adjusted (if that’s what they want to present). In college I found an obscure paper with a theory that because of the higher incidence and prevalence of psychopathy in historically individualized, Western societies vs. more communal Eastern traditions, it is indicative that the genes for psychopathy need that kind environment to be switched on. I still believe that. So putting the responsibility of fixing the next school shooter on an individual in a culture that values our kind of unindividualism is misguided at best.
"Lack of empathy" is itself a broad and problematic description that I think as been vastly overused (esp in autism spectrum research). When genuinely applicable, I think it is still easier to account for as an acquired or "learned" dysfunction than innate psychopathy. In the context of bullying in particular, a potentially critical development is when the victim can no longer identify many or most aggressors. From that point onward, "bullies" can no longer be differentiated from the "majority" population, and further distinctions between "enemies" and bystanders no longer apply.
The idea that every socially awkward and isolated kid is likely to be the next shooter is as bad as saying that black guy is likely to rape a white woman or the Latina is likely to shoplift or any of the other bullshit bigotry. The fucking teacher ought to be fired for his absolute stupidity.
And your own kids might have their own needs that require adult attention. I'm not saying your kids are fucked up (on the other hand, you comment on Wonkette, so...), just that each child needs something - needs a lot, in fact - from the educational experience. What they don't need is to be turned into amateur counselors for other children.
The "they just want a reaction!" part is correct. Where it goes off the rails is 1. blaming a child for getting upset when someone's deliberately trying to upset them and 2. assuming that, upon not getting the desired reaction, bullies will simply give up rather than escalating.
I think the real reason that piece of advice held on for so damn long is because it gives adults an excuse to do nothing.
And considering that the Venn diagram between mass shooters and white males who stalked, harassed, or were violent towards women is almost a circle, telling girls to give them attention is a recipe for trouble.
I couldn't agree more but in this country if the kids had walked out in protest of gun regulations and raising the age limits the "adults" would have applauded it as a God given right. It's a lot of retired military around here and locals that have been here for centuries. There's a forum - somd.com and some nastiest people in the world reside there with a hatred for democrats that exceeds fox news. I don't read it anymore - I need some peace in what's left of my life.
Robyn... This is the best and most accurate piece I have ever read, on bullying. Thanks for being one person who gets it. It is not the little wallflower waif, teased and sad, who goes on a rampage. It is usually the asshole who is also a bully, who tortures pets and fantasizes torturing women, who shoot up the place.
Suddenly the rightwing is all concerned with bullying. Blaming the victims is preferable to grabbing guns, to these psycholoons. When schools have wanted to have anti bullying classes, the rightwing has opposed them, ALWAYS, in the past. I think Frothy Santorum was the one who claimed a little bullying might straighten a sissy boy out. It may have been Dead Pat Robertson. It was one of those Morons. ... but now that the focus on guns is so strong the kids are walking out of school rather than being willing to be shot, the hypocritical psychopathic Rightwingers are all concerned about bullying.
Ugh. This country nauseates me. Humans nauseate me. Often.
exactly. preach! and these little ones are just living out what they see at home, so this really is a pipe dream to put the burden on them to act like fully mature and empathetic humans. they just want to go outside and play for godsake, not be the class psychologist.
Agreed - apology accepted, and apology issued.
Psychopathy is “anti-social” because it is a fundamental lack of empathy. It is not social isolation; indeed it is social manipulation in a way that can make the psychopath seem highly social and well-adjusted (if that’s what they want to present). In college I found an obscure paper with a theory that because of the higher incidence and prevalence of psychopathy in historically individualized, Western societies vs. more communal Eastern traditions, it is indicative that the genes for psychopathy need that kind environment to be switched on. I still believe that. So putting the responsibility of fixing the next school shooter on an individual in a culture that values our kind of unindividualism is misguided at best.
"Lack of empathy" is itself a broad and problematic description that I think as been vastly overused (esp in autism spectrum research). When genuinely applicable, I think it is still easier to account for as an acquired or "learned" dysfunction than innate psychopathy. In the context of bullying in particular, a potentially critical development is when the victim can no longer identify many or most aggressors. From that point onward, "bullies" can no longer be differentiated from the "majority" population, and further distinctions between "enemies" and bystanders no longer apply.
There was a going out of business sale that day.
Instead of rejecting the stupid phone, we should be embracing it and trying to find ways to use it constructively in the classroom.
The idea that every socially awkward and isolated kid is likely to be the next shooter is as bad as saying that black guy is likely to rape a white woman or the Latina is likely to shoplift or any of the other bullshit bigotry. The fucking teacher ought to be fired for his absolute stupidity.
And your own kids might have their own needs that require adult attention. I'm not saying your kids are fucked up (on the other hand, you comment on Wonkette, so...), just that each child needs something - needs a lot, in fact - from the educational experience. What they don't need is to be turned into amateur counselors for other children.
I literally yelled YES out loud, reading this.
Well done, Robyn. It's THIS exactly.
Yeah, sometimes there's a good reason why people don't talk to someone. Most kids don't want to befriend a budding Nazi.
The "they just want a reaction!" part is correct. Where it goes off the rails is 1. blaming a child for getting upset when someone's deliberately trying to upset them and 2. assuming that, upon not getting the desired reaction, bullies will simply give up rather than escalating.
I think the real reason that piece of advice held on for so damn long is because it gives adults an excuse to do nothing.
And considering that the Venn diagram between mass shooters and white males who stalked, harassed, or were violent towards women is almost a circle, telling girls to give them attention is a recipe for trouble.
Exactly. It's not just worthless advice, it's harmful.
Exactly!