While I absolutely agree that the use of both Hydroxychlorine and ivermectin was often used by those "doing their own research", I feel the need to point out that this was not necessarily the case with people in this study.
In the early days of the pandemic even the medical community was unsure of how to treat Covid. There was talk that hydroxychlorine might be a treatment option and hospitals stocked up on it just in case. It was several months before reliable studies were published showing that it to be ineffective.
I'm not excusing the people who continue to push junk science to people who don't know better, but the patients referenced are likely not those that we heard about demanding hydroxychloroquine to cure their Covid. It's quite possible that they received it because their doctors were trying anything to cure them.
Hydroxychloroquine, bleach, ivermectin, lighted butt plugs, chlorox, scientifically proven vaccinations, what's the diff? Six of one, half a dozen of another.
The thing about Covid, just like the 1918 flu, is that sometimes your “strong” immune system is not totally your friend. A lot of the terrible symptoms of these diseases is a result of your immune system’s reaction to the virus. Your body tries a lot of different ways to rid itself of the virus. I can see why the “idea” of suppressing the immune system would theoretically make sense in this case.
I've been taking HCQ for over five years for a skin condition I have. It's fairly safe in smaller doses (under the direction of a doctor of course) although the one major side effect is permanent blindness. I have an eye exam once a year to monitor any side effects but at my dosage level it's extremely rare.
Somehow, the notion of French people damaging their own health just to pwn the liberals and to show allegiance to Donnie the One Hit Wonder seems implausible, almost unthinkable to me. Yes, they do have their Front National and their Le Pens, they did provide the Nazis with plenty of volunteers, including the last defenders of the Fuhrerbunker in Berlin. Okay, there are dumbasses everywhere, having style does not necessarily prevent the cracking of your pot. But still, the country of Simone de Beauvoir and her sidekick J.P. Sartre falling for THAT kind of imported nonsense? Do they even have a Nouvelles Renard in France? Does the Evil Empire of Murdoch have beach heads in La Belle France? Tell me it is not so.
"Whatever the case, those 16,990 people probably died happy and feeling like they totally owned the libs. So that’s nice for them, at least."
More likely they died gasping for breath and wondering what was wrong with them since it couldn't possibly be the COVID that they didn't believe existed. And in the midst of the pandemic lockdowns, they likely also died alone.
another point that bears repeating is that thanks to the chuckleheads taking it for covid, people who needed it for lupus, sarcoidosis, MCTD, etc couldn't get it for months.
"It’s also worth noting that the people who took HCQ were largely anti-vaccine lunatics who probably did other stupid things as well, and it’s hard to tell if that was something taken into consideration in the previous study or not."
This also occurred to me. It's very hard to tease out the causation from other factors likely to be influencing these people. There are some laughably terrible 'studies' out there that claim that vaccines kill zillions of people based on ludicrous assumptions and extrapolations, so I'm a bit skeptical of all of these population-based studies until they've been vetted. This is not my area of expertise -- I wonder if Orac of Respectful insolence will weigh in? He actually knows his stuff when it comes to studies like this, and writes about these issues at great length -- perhaps, TOO great length.
By the way, I know a guy who took Ivermectin and was cured!
[He had intestinal parasites. That's what it's for.]
not good French, but still oddly appropriate
The stupid… it kills.
While I absolutely agree that the use of both Hydroxychlorine and ivermectin was often used by those "doing their own research", I feel the need to point out that this was not necessarily the case with people in this study.
In the early days of the pandemic even the medical community was unsure of how to treat Covid. There was talk that hydroxychlorine might be a treatment option and hospitals stocked up on it just in case. It was several months before reliable studies were published showing that it to be ineffective.
I'm not excusing the people who continue to push junk science to people who don't know better, but the patients referenced are likely not those that we heard about demanding hydroxychloroquine to cure their Covid. It's quite possible that they received it because their doctors were trying anything to cure them.
Nearly every person who used that crap looked like they could use a good de-worming.
Hydroxychloroquine, bleach, ivermectin, lighted butt plugs, chlorox, scientifically proven vaccinations, what's the diff? Six of one, half a dozen of another.
The thing about Covid, just like the 1918 flu, is that sometimes your “strong” immune system is not totally your friend. A lot of the terrible symptoms of these diseases is a result of your immune system’s reaction to the virus. Your body tries a lot of different ways to rid itself of the virus. I can see why the “idea” of suppressing the immune system would theoretically make sense in this case.
I can't help being afraid of a suppressed immune system in MAGA world, for fear of becoming one of them. Gah!
The stupid, it kills.
I've been taking HCQ for over five years for a skin condition I have. It's fairly safe in smaller doses (under the direction of a doctor of course) although the one major side effect is permanent blindness. I have an eye exam once a year to monitor any side effects but at my dosage level it's extremely rare.
Somehow, the notion of French people damaging their own health just to pwn the liberals and to show allegiance to Donnie the One Hit Wonder seems implausible, almost unthinkable to me. Yes, they do have their Front National and their Le Pens, they did provide the Nazis with plenty of volunteers, including the last defenders of the Fuhrerbunker in Berlin. Okay, there are dumbasses everywhere, having style does not necessarily prevent the cracking of your pot. But still, the country of Simone de Beauvoir and her sidekick J.P. Sartre falling for THAT kind of imported nonsense? Do they even have a Nouvelles Renard in France? Does the Evil Empire of Murdoch have beach heads in La Belle France? Tell me it is not so.
They translated the Left Behind books for the fundamentalists in France. It's called Gauche Derriere.
Natural selection's consequences for willful stupidity.
"Whatever the case, those 16,990 people probably died happy and feeling like they totally owned the libs. So that’s nice for them, at least."
More likely they died gasping for breath and wondering what was wrong with them since it couldn't possibly be the COVID that they didn't believe existed. And in the midst of the pandemic lockdowns, they likely also died alone.
All of which I take as a solid win for Darwin.
Not really, since many of them are older folks who already had kids.
another point that bears repeating is that thanks to the chuckleheads taking it for covid, people who needed it for lupus, sarcoidosis, MCTD, etc couldn't get it for months.
To be fair, it's hard to keep track of all the shit these morons causing. They're like a kraken of shit, making everything everywhere worse.
"It’s also worth noting that the people who took HCQ were largely anti-vaccine lunatics who probably did other stupid things as well, and it’s hard to tell if that was something taken into consideration in the previous study or not."
This also occurred to me. It's very hard to tease out the causation from other factors likely to be influencing these people. There are some laughably terrible 'studies' out there that claim that vaccines kill zillions of people based on ludicrous assumptions and extrapolations, so I'm a bit skeptical of all of these population-based studies until they've been vetted. This is not my area of expertise -- I wonder if Orac of Respectful insolence will weigh in? He actually knows his stuff when it comes to studies like this, and writes about these issues at great length -- perhaps, TOO great length.
By the way, I know a guy who took Ivermectin and was cured!
[He had intestinal parasites. That's what it's for.]
Yeah we had to take that once. Children are filthy little poo eating loons under the age of 5.
Ta, Robyn. Off-label use can be a double edged sword.
16,990 down. 74 million to go.
“Whatever the case, those 16,990 people probably died happy and feeling like they totally owned the libs. So that’s nice for them, at least.”
They sure showed us!
Oh, oh, oh I am SO pwned!!!