Hey kids, we're back with Book Club talk in the comments, and a reminder to please focus on talking about the book or about climate and clean energy. News of your cats, annoying neighbors (god they're so annoying!) and other open-thread content is of course cherished and should be posted in the Nice Times post coming at 1:00 EST.
And yes, there will be instructions on how to join the video chat when it goes up at noon Eastern, 'bout an hour from now!
Oh, it was a little frustrating with the off topic stuff. But today, once the video chat starts, I'll have no idea what's going on in here, lol. It'll be like having s substitute teacher.
I’ll never forget reading an article during the Great Recession about Dubai being so glutted with oil money that they air-conditioned a beach. Motherfucker, WHAT?
I hadn't seen this form of energy storage before, but it looks promising and doesn't use limited resources like some batteries do -- liquefied air:
***The world’s largest demonstration plant for a new kind of renewable energy storage is up and running in the west of the China.
Called liquid-air energy storage (LAES) the plant uses renewable electricity to compress air to extreme densities until it turns to liquid. It can then be rapidly released to power a turbine and discharge that green energy back into the grid.
China has received numerous plaudits for its rapid adoption of renewable energy at both scale and speed, and this new facility in Qinghai Province brings in a key missing element to the renewable build-out: grid-scale battery storage for when the Sun isn’t shining and the wind isn’t blowing.***
Ta, Dok. I read McKibbon's book last year; borrowed it from NYPL on your recommendation. I loved it. On our mountain upstate, it's a winter wonderland outside; we had two days of snow and it's lovely. A contractor is supposed to come today for a walk-through because the weather side of the house needs insulation and re-siding. Eventually, we want rooftop solar and a small wind turbine farther up on our property, along with the battery storage required. We got a heat pump when we got a Biden tax credit for it and it's great. In NYC we rent a top floor tenement (built in 1899) where years ago I turned off all the radiators because heat rises and that's usually enough to keep the place warm enough. We have a small electric ceramic heater for really cold days. I'm hoping our progressive Mayor Mamdani can convince City Council that balcony solar panels are a great idea; we don't use the fire escape for anything else. Let's do this, indeed!
And real guardrails have to exist that prevents the next Reublican president that looks like a gameshow host and doesn't start a war ruin all progress . . .
If you think about it, crude oil is just stored sunshine. It makes more sense on multiple levels to take that photon energy right from the source and put it into a nice, clean battery.
I know McKibben is focused on solar/wind but does he speak about fusion? There really has been a lot of activity in fusion in recent years, driven by a good chunk of VC money (including VC arms of fossil fuel companies like Chevron). Yes I know the old joke that for 50 years we’ve been 10 years away from viable fusion energy.
The other thing that you mentioned, the locality of people that can offer solar. Sure, they’ll get bought out out eventually, but does one really want chevron holding all the cards immediately?
Not in the part I've read. His position on nuclear generally seems to be that it makes sense to keep existing plants running, but that new plants are too expensive and slow to bring online to be helpful right now. Fusion, as something that doesn't even work yet, isn't really competitive with solar tech that's become truly efficient in the last decade.
I've only just started this book. Got through the intro and chapter 1 yesterday.
I'm curious to see some of what you've highlighted in these posts, but a part of me is already asking "Did this need a whole book?" That intro and first chapter already make a very strong argument for switching to as much solar as possible as quickly as possible.
One of the downsides of renting, of course, is that I can't just switch my place over to solar and heat pumps of my own accord.
OMG yes the "downsides of renting" part! As an apartment-dweller when the IRA passed, there wasn't a lot for me to partake in, even though I was excited about the bill! Getting the energy transition working for renters has to be addressed. (like, let's get solar on top of all parking, with lots of places for residents to charge.)
Also not quite here yet but on the way; Utah and California have passed laws allowing "balcony solar," which can be used by renters, or will be once the equipment is available in a year or so. More in the first preview for the book club, here:
My complex is a bunch of buildings, all ground floor. In theory, the company that owns it could put panels on all our roofs, but they wouldn't be the ones who make a return on that investment.
Another OMG, because I just saw an article about a company in Australia that's selling a system that'll interface with rooftop panels on a multi-unit building and distribute rooftop solar to multiple units and handle the billing .... I will look for that in a bit.
I wonder if that would make it profitable for landlords. Let the company charge us directly for electric and take the other company that we have to sign up with now out of it.
Since electric is the only utility bill we have in this complex, I'm sure most of us here would go for that.
So I'm thrilled with part 3 of this book. I'm still riding the high of the midterm results, and I want that to continue as long as possible, which means I am grateful, Dok, that you chose this easy to consume and very important call to action for the Wonkette Book Club Resurrection and Hopium Emporium. More as I gather my thoughts.
I'd actually forgotten that the old Chevron ad with the cartoon dinosaurs turning into oil was urging people to drive responsibly so dead dinos wouldn't be wasted. And man, wasn't that oboe music used in a million other ads?
I say this over and over but I think we as a country should be celebrating a new breakthrough or milestone in the energy transition every week. Instead we have silence on the topic of renewable energy. Instead we get endless coverage of data centers and AI without contrasting these speculative computational resources against the real and immediate economic gain from green electrification
Assmouth promotes data centers not only because he's heavily invested in the companies that need them, but also because building them is boosting economic numbers. That's a boondoggle akin to when China built cities that nobody lives in, but worse in many ways too. We could instead have a renewable energy construction boom that would be FAR more worthwhile, but that fucker has done everything possible to stop that. It's fucking criminal.
The problem is those data centers are, currently, undermining the gains we're making. Particularly with the current admin, it's cheaper and faster to just take from the local grid or build effectively a massive gas generator to power it than to do it right. And we don't need 90% of the new data centers except for a dead-end tech whose bubble needs to just fucking burst already.
We don't have silence, we have the president buying off new offshore wind projects because he has a childish bias against wind. One more example of the executive having too much power over things he's totally ignorant about. Be nice if we could fix that.
Hey kids, we're back with Book Club talk in the comments, and a reminder to please focus on talking about the book or about climate and clean energy. News of your cats, annoying neighbors (god they're so annoying!) and other open-thread content is of course cherished and should be posted in the Nice Times post coming at 1:00 EST.
And yes, there will be instructions on how to join the video chat when it goes up at noon Eastern, 'bout an hour from now!
I tried to talk to my annoying neighbor about clean energy but he kept bringing up Shakira Law in Michigan because the Arabs are taking over.
I tried, Dok
I hope you have a better Sunday than last Sunday at this time.
Oh, it was a little frustrating with the off topic stuff. But today, once the video chat starts, I'll have no idea what's going on in here, lol. It'll be like having s substitute teacher.
All energy is solar energy. Even the food we eat comes from photosynthesis
Finished reading “Fields of Fire” by James Webb. Lieutenant leading Marines on pointless patrols in South Vietnam.
No Hollywood ending
I’ll never forget reading an article during the Great Recession about Dubai being so glutted with oil money that they air-conditioned a beach. Motherfucker, WHAT?
Thanks so much, Dok, for choosing an inaugural book that's perfectly suited to catch this rising tide of optimism!
I hadn't seen this form of energy storage before, but it looks promising and doesn't use limited resources like some batteries do -- liquefied air:
***The world’s largest demonstration plant for a new kind of renewable energy storage is up and running in the west of the China.
Called liquid-air energy storage (LAES) the plant uses renewable electricity to compress air to extreme densities until it turns to liquid. It can then be rapidly released to power a turbine and discharge that green energy back into the grid.
China has received numerous plaudits for its rapid adoption of renewable energy at both scale and speed, and this new facility in Qinghai Province brings in a key missing element to the renewable build-out: grid-scale battery storage for when the Sun isn’t shining and the wind isn’t blowing.***
https://www.goodnewsnetwork.org/worlds-largest-liquid-air-renewable-energy-storage-system-switches-on/
Virginia Foxx is against solar because she got along just fine before the sun came along, thank you very much.
Ta, Dok. I read McKibbon's book last year; borrowed it from NYPL on your recommendation. I loved it. On our mountain upstate, it's a winter wonderland outside; we had two days of snow and it's lovely. A contractor is supposed to come today for a walk-through because the weather side of the house needs insulation and re-siding. Eventually, we want rooftop solar and a small wind turbine farther up on our property, along with the battery storage required. We got a heat pump when we got a Biden tax credit for it and it's great. In NYC we rent a top floor tenement (built in 1899) where years ago I turned off all the radiators because heat rises and that's usually enough to keep the place warm enough. We have a small electric ceramic heater for really cold days. I'm hoping our progressive Mayor Mamdani can convince City Council that balcony solar panels are a great idea; we don't use the fire escape for anything else. Let's do this, indeed!
I just got the book. My e reader disappeared and it took a lengthy search with a lot of cussing to find it.
Society has to shift and want solutions.
And real guardrails have to exist that prevents the next Reublican president that looks like a gameshow host and doesn't start a war ruin all progress . . .
If you think about it, crude oil is just stored sunshine. It makes more sense on multiple levels to take that photon energy right from the source and put it into a nice, clean battery.
And, if you burn wood to heat your home, it's the same thing, just newer.
Absolutely!
I know McKibben is focused on solar/wind but does he speak about fusion? There really has been a lot of activity in fusion in recent years, driven by a good chunk of VC money (including VC arms of fossil fuel companies like Chevron). Yes I know the old joke that for 50 years we’ve been 10 years away from viable fusion energy.
He mentions it as a really promising technology that could be wonderful if it gets here, but we can't wait for it in the time we have.
And to modify the joke, there's been so much progress that we're now only permanently FIVE years away.
The other thing that you mentioned, the locality of people that can offer solar. Sure, they’ll get bought out out eventually, but does one really want chevron holding all the cards immediately?
Not in the part I've read. His position on nuclear generally seems to be that it makes sense to keep existing plants running, but that new plants are too expensive and slow to bring online to be helpful right now. Fusion, as something that doesn't even work yet, isn't really competitive with solar tech that's become truly efficient in the last decade.
I've only just started this book. Got through the intro and chapter 1 yesterday.
I'm curious to see some of what you've highlighted in these posts, but a part of me is already asking "Did this need a whole book?" That intro and first chapter already make a very strong argument for switching to as much solar as possible as quickly as possible.
One of the downsides of renting, of course, is that I can't just switch my place over to solar and heat pumps of my own accord.
OMG yes the "downsides of renting" part! As an apartment-dweller when the IRA passed, there wasn't a lot for me to partake in, even though I was excited about the bill! Getting the energy transition working for renters has to be addressed. (like, let's get solar on top of all parking, with lots of places for residents to charge.)
Also not quite here yet but on the way; Utah and California have passed laws allowing "balcony solar," which can be used by renters, or will be once the equipment is available in a year or so. More in the first preview for the book club, here:
https://www.wonkette.com/p/sun-sun-sun-here-it-comes-some-solar
My complex is a bunch of buildings, all ground floor. In theory, the company that owns it could put panels on all our roofs, but they wouldn't be the ones who make a return on that investment.
Another OMG, because I just saw an article about a company in Australia that's selling a system that'll interface with rooftop panels on a multi-unit building and distribute rooftop solar to multiple units and handle the billing .... I will look for that in a bit.
I wonder if that would make it profitable for landlords. Let the company charge us directly for electric and take the other company that we have to sign up with now out of it.
Since electric is the only utility bill we have in this complex, I'm sure most of us here would go for that.
So I'm thrilled with part 3 of this book. I'm still riding the high of the midterm results, and I want that to continue as long as possible, which means I am grateful, Dok, that you chose this easy to consume and very important call to action for the Wonkette Book Club Resurrection and Hopium Emporium. More as I gather my thoughts.
Yay, glad to hear it!
Fight With Your Relatives Day and Sacred Baby Festival have just been added to my vocabulary. Thanks Dok!
We call it Super Sacred Immigrant Baby Festival around here.
I don't even remember what podcast I stole Sacred Baby Festival from! But Fight With your Relatives Day is a new coinage, as far as I know.
I'd actually forgotten that the old Chevron ad with the cartoon dinosaurs turning into oil was urging people to drive responsibly so dead dinos wouldn't be wasted. And man, wasn't that oboe music used in a million other ads?
https://youtu.be/4hRXNr4qtHs
To be pedantic, it's a bassoon -- the clumsy grandpa of the orchestral world, thanks to Prokofiev. Ironically, it's wind-powered.
I went back and forth and guessed wrong
2 reeds is 1 too many
I say this over and over but I think we as a country should be celebrating a new breakthrough or milestone in the energy transition every week. Instead we have silence on the topic of renewable energy. Instead we get endless coverage of data centers and AI without contrasting these speculative computational resources against the real and immediate economic gain from green electrification
Assmouth promotes data centers not only because he's heavily invested in the companies that need them, but also because building them is boosting economic numbers. That's a boondoggle akin to when China built cities that nobody lives in, but worse in many ways too. We could instead have a renewable energy construction boom that would be FAR more worthwhile, but that fucker has done everything possible to stop that. It's fucking criminal.
The problem is those data centers are, currently, undermining the gains we're making. Particularly with the current admin, it's cheaper and faster to just take from the local grid or build effectively a massive gas generator to power it than to do it right. And we don't need 90% of the new data centers except for a dead-end tech whose bubble needs to just fucking burst already.
Is that you John? John "Blame is for god and small children"?
I don't understand the reference
Then you are not that John, which is great! Hi & my apologies : )
We don't have silence, we have the president buying off new offshore wind projects because he has a childish bias against wind. One more example of the executive having too much power over things he's totally ignorant about. Be nice if we could fix that.
We took a step toward fixing that. A Congress that actually does its job is supposed to check his power.